Tornadoes that should have been rated F5/EF5

[Kevin Bowman]

I am going by the amount of damage I personally saw

What happened in Garland, Texas is a good example of what we see might not be completely accurate. I am not saying that the tornado may have no created small spots of EF5 damage but a lot more goes into it than just seeing what might be EF5 damage. In the end though whether its a 4 or 5 doesn't mean anything to those whose lives were destroyed.

 

[Adam Lucio]

While I was down helping out in Washington, IL after the tornado I was chatting with some of the local officials and they said a 5 rating was initially considered but they backed off due to political reasons. How much validity there is to that story I don't know, but thats what I was told. It was given a top level EF-4 rating. Not to mention the thing had a really quick forward speed and did all that damage with a minimal impact time on those structures. Truly a powerful beast.

 

[rdale]

Interesting - any ideas what "political unrest" would occur if it was an EF5? Who are the types of people that would have pressured them?

 

[Jeff Duda]

I had heard similar rumblings about the Parkersburg, IA tornado in 2008. Obviously they decided to go with a 5 eventually, but initially they held it at EF4 for two days before upgrading. I'm guessing the difference between and EF4 and an EF5 is the amount of state or federal disaster relief that may become available, and not wanting to gain a bad reputation of always overrating tornadoes just to get more money.

 

[Andy Berrington]

I had heard similar rumblings about the Parkersburg, IA tornado in 2008. Obviously they decided to go with a 5 eventually, but initially they held it at EF4 for two days before upgrading. I'm guessing the difference between and EF4 and an EF5 is the amount of state or federal disaster relief that may become available, and not wanting to gain a bad reputation of always overrating tornadoes just to get more money.

Knowing the level of damage that monster caused, that would've been pretty egregious.

As far as the practical economic side goes (monetary losses and whatnot), I would think an EF4 and EF5 are essentially the same. EF5 tornadoes might sweep homes and other structures away, but EF4 already devastates them to the point where they are total losses anyway. If the stigma surrounding the EF5 rating is the reason for this political grievance, then perhaps these folks need to be reminded that the method for rating tornadoes is similarly objective (or should be) to the one for rating hurricanes, just with damage replacing wind speed as the variable in question (unless I'm missing something).

 

[rdale]

I'm guessing the difference between and EF4 and an EF5 is the amount of state or federal disaster relief that may become available

No. That's not even part of the relief request process. We turn in how much damage was uninsured - if it passes a certain level, then aid is available. If it doesn't, then aid is not available. The "how" is irrelevant.

 

[Stephen Szulborski]

I had heard similar rumblings about the Parkersburg, IA tornado in 2008. Obviously they decided to go with a 5 eventually, but initially they held it at EF4 for two days before upgrading. I'm guessing the difference between and EF4 and an EF5 is the amount of state or federal disaster relief that may become available, and not wanting to gain a bad reputation of always overrating tornadoes just to get more money.

When hearing about this issue, this was my guess as well.

 

[rdale]

When hearing about this issue, this was my guess as well.

As someone who turns in damage assessments - I'll reiterate that the EF scale rating is not even an option on the form

 

[Stephen Szulborski]

As someone who turns in damage assessments - I'll reiterate that the EF scale rating is not even an option on the form

Damage assessments by insurance companies? Usually the tornado has been rated by that point... Plus we are talking state and federal funding not insurance companies. Like if an area is declared a disaster area by the state or at the federal level.

 

[rdale]

I have no idea what insurance companies do, but I can guarantee that my policy doesn't say "You get less money if it's EF4 than EF5"

State and federal damage funds have NOTHING to do with the cause. It's about one thing and one thing alone - uninsured cost. FEMA doesn't pay for damage that insurance covers, they pay for damage that is uninsured IF it meets a population based criteria. It is not related to EF scale ratings.

 

[Pete Kustra]

I have no idea what insurance companies do, but I can guarantee that my policy doesn't say "You get less money if it's EF4 than EF5"

State and federal damage funds have NOTHING to do with the cause. It's about one thing and one thing alone - uninsured cost. FEMA doesn't pay for damage that insurance covers, they pay for damage that is uninsured IF it meets a population based criteria. It is not related to EF scale ratings.

Could it have to do with avoiding national/regional attention and obstructive news media?

 

[rdale]

By the time the EF number comes out, the national media is gone. It takes a day or two (at least) to come up with numbers when they're talking 4/5.

 

[Vinny Bell]

This is recent- surprisingly. I believe (and still do) that the Mayfield Tornado should have been rated EF-5. For example, there was immense ground scouring, then there was a well-anchored house that was completely leveled. (There are also many cases as such around Mayfield)

Furthermore, I believe that the Winterset-Norwalk tornado (EF-4) in Iowa should have been EF-5. Such as in Winterset. There was immense damage to a medium-to-well-anchored garage that was ripped off its foundation.
Feel free to correct me!

Winterset-Norwalk: March 5th, 2022. (EF-4)
Mayfield: December 10th, 2021. (EF-4)

 

[Ethan Schisler]

This is recent- surprisingly. I believe (and still do) that the Mayfield Tornado should have been rated EF-5. For example, there was immense ground scouring, then there was a well-anchored house that was completely leveled. (There are also many cases as such around Mayfield)

Furthermore, I believe that the Winterset-Norwalk tornado (EF-4) in Iowa should have been EF-5. Such as in Winterset. There was immense damage to a medium-to-well-anchored garage that was ripped off its foundation.
Feel free to correct me!

Winterset-Norwalk: March 5th, 2022. (EF-4)
Mayfield: December 10th, 2021. (EF-4)

The Mayfield tornado probably is a contender in spots, but that is just how the system works. The long track South Central IA EF-4 on Saturday imo was not even close to being EF-5. None of the damage indicators suggest such and NWS Des Moines went with a low end EF-4 rating with winds of 170 mph. Still very devastating. Even if the garage was swept clean away from its foundation, NWS officials look at surrounding damage as well to make sure it lines up with that caliber of damage/wind speed. In this case, the house probably wasn't totally destroyed, and a garage alone is not sufficient enough evidence to warrant an EF-5 damage point. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but a garage or attached building alone being flattened, would not warrant such. There are also questions about how it is constructed, anchored etc. Answers that were likely given to NWS officials when rating the tornado that led them to arrive at a EF-4 170 mph rating.

 

[rdale]

There was immense damage to a medium-to-well-anchored garage that was ripped off its foundation.

Make sure you are using the Damage Indicators. Notice that outbuildings by default can't be used for EF5.

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