ST's Future Discussion

[Rob H]

As for expenses, if the site is hosted in the cloud in order to scale properly, the costs will be higher than mid-hundreds. Add on pay-for modules, VB updates and a higher-end chat area, among other things I'm interested in, and you have a few thousand in cash outlay per year.

The worst thing about the cloud and the hype behind it is that people believe that it automatically allows for easy horizontal scaling. My best understanding of vBulletin's issues with scaling are tied into underperformant PHP and weak caching strategies, and moving from a single MySQL db to a cluster with pub/sub. That takes a ton of work, because VB was never intended to scale. You're trying to patch up a monster by spending thousands of dollars on more crappy code, which is part of the reason why I'm really excited about the possibility of a move away from VB. Aside from all that, I doubt ST is currently hitting any performance walls right now with the traffic and participation that it gets.

If Tim stays on, or kind of stays on, or leaves and transfers to Patrick, Skip, SMOK, Kanye West, whoever, I never really had much of a dog in that fight. I know Patrick and Skip and know either would do an amazing job, I don't know Jeff Snyder or SMOK very well so I can't say much about either of them. So my interest was always with the technology. When you start talking about thousands of dollars a year in costs to run a forum with low participation, then you're chained to thinking about cash injections and revenue streams. Treating the site like a business, and being chained to the needs of the business is horrible if it's not necessary. It's why companies have skunkworks/blackops teams.

I think dumping a ton of money and time into trying to make VB do more has a poor ROI, and I'm surprised that people think it's the best course of action right now. If I were made CTO of Hypothetical StormTrack, Inc my first goals would be to assess the current issues (db needing periodic restarts) and evaluate expenses in regards to current resource use. Stability is the #1 problem affecting the site right now, and if we have an understanding of the issues there, we can freely dig into the other main issues like removing barriers to contribution, and engaging more user contribution.

 

[Marcus Diaz]

I think the chat can stay as it is. The main thing about the financial side is keeping the lights on. Once we have that covered then we can look at updated modules and add ons. We really just need to start small and work our way up. Personally, I vote for a new owner/admin. I know Tim said he didn't want to do this because it's a burdon on someone's hands, but SMOK has been pretty adamant about handling everything from scratch. I say why not? Why not see if someone with a lot of time and a plan can pump life back into the site? What more do we have to lose at this point?

 

[Mark Blue]

It's a good thing that we have members who care about ST and are willing to give of themselves in an effort to try and improve our forum. One thing you can be sure of is that SMOK didn't tell us every single detail of what he has in mind, he just scratched the surface to give us a glimpse of what ST could become if everyone committed to the change. Change is never easy, but it can be cathartic to the soul if it's for the right reasons.

I sure was surprised at how short of a clock we were given to actually flesh anything out. I thought no decisions were going to be made until after the holidays? It seems like a moving target now (changing daily), as in something we'll never hit no matter how hard we try. I believe some here were probably looking for the courage to speak up, before they even had the opportunity to do so.

If I put my cohorts Jeff and Patrick in a place they never wanted to be in I apologize. I was only trying to think of capable replacements (Skip included) who I think have the moxie to move up to the wheelhouse.

 

[Dan Robinson]

What Steve brings to the table is the business know-how to make sure the lights stay on, that we can afford to make necessary upgrades and that we never get to the point where the site is in danger of being shut down unless members chip in to help pay the bill. He's already stated that this site would be a not-for-profit endeavor, so I don't see anything caustic about an approach that ensures there is revenue to cover the costs. Keep in mind that ST's future will involve not just a forum, but a host of services and features designed to serve, entertain, and educate the chaser.

I have no prejudices toward any potential owner/leader - what is most important is that we can move forward. Any solution that gets us to the starting line and keeps us growing (not just now, but years from now) is where we need to be.

 

[Patrick Marsh]

Mark, no applies needed. I am here watching the thread and read it daily. (Heck, I have push notifications being sent to my phone!)

As for being in charge, I have the resources to keep the lights on, and I have technical abilities (or the ability to learn) to keep the board running.

However, for me, I view running Stormtrack as a privilege. It's something I would do if asked; it's not something I would seek.

 

[Mark Blue]

We still need to answer your questions up thread too Patrick. I'm not sure I know the answers to what you asked though. It is a privilege and not to be taken lightly, you are correct.

 

[Rob H]

I believe some here were probably looking for the courage to speak up, before they even had the opportunity to do so.

Yeah, this thread whole ordeal has been kind of a circus, but that's why I'm glad Tim just went ahead and made a decision. I hope no one needs courage to give an opinion about how a forum is run, because at the end of the day, it's just a forum. Some people might be upset if Tim does nothing, or he does just enough to keep the lights on, or SMOK takes over, or whatever - but we need to remember that *we are* the community, and the fate of a domain and associated forum isn't the end of the world. It's great that we're 25-pages-of-bickering passionate about this, but let's try to keep things in perspective.

edit: I'm not accusing Mark or anyone of being irrational, just throwing that out in general

Funny, it all started around a conversation about moving ST to FB and morphed into what it is now. It would be nice to *move on* as Dan said, so this doesn't keep coming up at the end of each year. I imagine we'll get to see Tim's plan unfold soon enough as January is just around the corner.

I completely agree.

 

[Mark Blue]

Funny, it all started around a conversation about moving ST to FB and morphed into what it is now. It would be nice to *move on* as Dan said, so this doesn't keep coming up at the end of each year. I imagine we'll get to see Tim's plan unfold soon enough as January is just around the corner.

 

[Ben Holcomb]

Steve would, in my opinion, bring quite a bit of new ideas to this site whether he dumped vb or scaled it out. VB sites have a hard time scaling, but it can be done with proper hardware and know-how. There are a lot of vb sites bigger than this one out there with loads more traffic.

Having someone with the financial capacity to back during a transition period is important. Steve seems like a perfect person to do so, and has been interested for years in making this a better place for everyone.

 

[Danny Neal]

Having known SMOK for years, I was excited to see him (once again) throw his name in the ring to take ownership. I feel he would be the best candidate for the job strictly from a business standpoint. His continual consulting and entrepreneurial skills would have this site running smoothly. It is up to the rest of us to infuse new information and keep the dimly lit torch on fire. It seems like each candidate has their own specialty that would be worthwhile to have added to an admin team.

 

[Wes Carter]

I would like to see Skip, Patrick, SMOK, or anyone take over who will keep the forum alive and functional. I haven't participated much the past couple of years because I grew kind of frustrated with several things that have already been addressed. But I think that having a webzine with articles and a connection to social media is a great way to breathe new life into Stormtrack. Embracing the new and the roots of Stormtrack while keeping the wealth of knowledge in the archives would most certainly have me excited to participate again.

I agree 100% with those who want to return to using real names, even if we can use our first name and last initial or vice versa. The quality of interaction declined when any nickname could be used.

 

[Jeff_Hawkins]

Sorry, I'm a late-comer to this thread, and haven't read through all posts so forgive me if this has already been pointed out. In reading the posts, these two snippets get at the foundation of what issues lie with storm chasing currently, and StormTrack in particular:
From a post by Dan Robinson 11/21:
"The forum existed and was successful because people from differing backgrounds were interested enough to look past whatever personal shortcomings they saw within the fourm itself to be able to exchange knowledge, ideas, war stories, whatever. " and "I see the restoration of ST as the restoration of a community, not just the restoration of a web site or forum. In reality that is what I care about in this whole effort. The web site/forum is just a means to that end. "
It's not who is in charge, or what features are offered, or what technical or social trends ST complies with. People will use ST because it meets needs. Knowledge needs (which are always repeating themselves if you haven't noticed), communication needs (especially on chase days and forecasting), and connection needs (meeting other chasers, hooking newbies up with veterans, mentoring, etc.). ST has been, is, and can continue to be that, if these core needs continue to be met. Does ST have a mission and vision statement? Should it have?
Just some thoughts from reading posts as a relative noob/ very much non-expert, and I hope they aren't stupid, but helpful to developing a constructive resolution and direction moving forward for the site.

 

[T Metz]

I am hopeful seeing this discussion that ST is moving forward in a healthy direction. I am guilty of being a lurker. Generally upon arriving at an interesting discussion, historically there has been little I could add that would move the conversation forward. ST has been invaluable to me as a learning tool as I have tried to improve my forecasting skills. I have made some great friends from being part of this group. When requested, I have contributed financially to ST. I am certainly willing to help in anyway I can with the changes being contemplated here.

 

[Marcus Diaz]

You know, this sorta bums me out. I've seen several people begging for more participation to keep this place going. Then, in mid December, we get a fat stovepipe in Kansas and a brief needle tornado near OKC (the "hub" of chasing) and yet not one peep about it. Its hard for a handful of us to keep posting as part of participation when essentially we're just talking amongst ourselves.

 

[Tim Vasquez]

Thanks all, I appreciate the suggestions and comments. Mark, you are correct that this has been a moving target and I have been on the fence over the past couple of weeks, but this is not a decision I'm taking lightly. I'm reading all the inputs and suggestions as they come in, and thinking & rethinking the issues.

What I anticipate at this point is:

- A decision on the new Stormtrack administrator toward the tail end of the holidays, likely January 1 or whenever I get back from San Antonio.

- 100% wholesale transfer of the board and the domain to the new administrator.

I strongly encourage discussion and debate on the forthcoming transition. As I mentioned a few days ago, this is the time to ask questions and get answers from the candidates, because this will be a permanent change in leadership and my decisions will be based largely on the discussion that emerges from this dialogue. It goes without saying that what one candidate brings to Stormtrack will be better than what another candidate brings, so this is the time to make sure your concerns, wishes, and hopes for Stormtrack in 2015 get exposure. I am going to follow up on this by sending out a mass e-mail so that others who aren't following the discussion (this being December) can participate.

Ultimately it is upon me to make the final decision, and it will be based on not necessarily who is the loudest or makes the best sales pitch, but on who I feel will bring the best leadership to the site and who has the respect and support of the user base. This is essentially a changing of the guard of a 37-year old institution, and we are now standing at the crossroads.

Tim