Dual Layer DVDs

[Bill Hark]

I am in the process of putting together a tornado video project that will be almost two hours. I have not been impressed with the video quality when I've tried to squeeze that amount of video unto a regular DVD,

Has anybody had experience with dual layer (DVD-9) DVD's? My computer and Premiere Pro has the capability and I've seen commercial services advertise dual layer DVD duplication and replication.

My concern is compatability with standard home players. Any experience with using commercial sevices and the dual layer format?

Bill Hark

 

[Steve Miller]

I have dual layer and have had success with publishing my 2005 season on the DVD well in to the second layer. It plays fine on all of my DVD players; one being a second-generation player from back in the late 90's.
There is a little lull in the video when it switches layers on my standalone players. The lull is not present on the computer DVD drives I have.

I use Vegas 6 to edit, render, and burn DVD's.
Media expense sucks but I love having that much space for video!

 

[B Ozanne]

I thought all DVD players were dual-layer. Well, almost all.

Biggest downfall of the dual layer writer is the cost of the DVD's, several times more than regular 4.7gb dvds.

Im surprised you are not happy with the DVD quality. I routinely "backup" 3 hour movies on 4.7gb discs with little loss in quality, and Im watching them on a 40" screen. Ever try shrinking your home movies with DVD Shrink?

 

[John Diel]

DVD9 has been the standard for Commercial DVD's for sometime now. The reason we didn't see it until recently in Home Computers is the burning technology hadn't caught up. Remember, Commercial DVD's are "pressed" and not "burned" as to do on our home computers.

DVDp or Dual Layer is the industry standard for all stand alone DVD players built in the last 5 years. The "pause" or short "lock up" we hear about on the DVD9 is the laser changing focus to read the second layer. Some players handle this better than others and the pause can be not noticable at all to a couple of seconds, depending on the 'read ahead' functions built into the player.

Currently the +R format is most prevelent in the DL technology. It is compatible with the majority of DVD players built in the last three years. There is also a method called "Bitrate Setting" in that you set yur oftware to burn DVD ROM and that pretty well takes care of any compatibility issues. The DVD player then reads the DVD as any other commercial DVD.

DVD+R DL are considerably more expensive than DVD-/+R. I can pickup DVD single layers for about 75 cents a disc. Whereas the DVD DL's are about $3.00 on average.

Hope that helps clear some of the murky waters out there.

John

 

[Bill Tabor]

Originally posted by John Diel

Currently the +R format is most prevelent in the DL technology. It is compatible with the majority of DVD players built in the last three years. There is also a method called "Bitrate Setting" in that you set yur oftware to burn DVD ROM and that pretty well takes care of any compatibility issues. The DVD player then reads the DVD as any other commercial DVD.

John how do you use this Bitrate Setting? Also is Dvd-9 the same as dual layer on pc's? I have a dual layer burner but never tried to burn a dual disk yet.

 

[John Diel]

Bill,

The bitsetting is done in the software you're using to burn the DVD's. It's somewhere in the settings. Nero is set to do this automatically (or, at least mine does it) depending on the DVD format you place in the burner and what you are doing with that DVD. Straight up data backup is usally whatever the default for the burner is. However, DVD Movie, and Nero sets the format (bitset) for DVD-ROM when using DVD+R discs. It does not do this for DVD-R discs.

I found out just the other day how the DVD5 and DVD9 translates. So, Yes, DVD9 is indeed Dual Layer, or 8.5 GB. DVD5 is single layer and 4.7 GB.

Hope that helps. Do a google search for "bitsetting" (not "bit rate setting" as I reported previously) and you will find quite a bit of information on this.

 

[Bill Tabor]

Originally posted by John Diel
Bill,

The bitsetting is done in the software you're using to burn the DVD's. It's somewhere in the settings. Nero is set to do this automatically (or, at least mine does it) depending on the DVD format you place in the burner and what you are doing with that DVD. Straight up data backup is usally whatever the default for the burner is. However, DVD Movie, and Nero sets the format (bitset) for DVD-ROM when using DVD+R discs. It does not do this for DVD-R discs.

I found out just the other day how the DVD5 and DVD9 translates. So, Yes, DVD9 is indeed Dual Layer, or 8.5 GB. DVD5 is single layer and 4.7 GB.

Hope that helps. Do a google search for "bitsetting" (not "bit rate setting" as I reported previously) and you will find quite a bit of information on this.

So you're saying if you burn a dvd dual layer disk that is the same as a commercial cd which is dvd9 right? I thought dvd9 had to be pressed.

 

[Pat Lawrence]

These look pretty cool:

http://www.sony.net/Products/MO-Drive/ProD...oDATA/products/

Not that I'm marketing them, and they are a bit of overkill for most
If I remember correctly (I researched them a couple of years ago) their storage capacity is expected to exceed 50 gbs or so per disk! I was looking at them for data storage, so I'm not sure if they will play in a DVD player...probably not, but it is wonderful technology!

Pat

 

[Jeff Snyder]

Originally posted by Pat Lawrence

If I remember correctly (I researched them a couple of years ago) their storage capacity is expected to exceed 50 gbs or so per disk!

Pat

Dual-layer Blu-Ray disks will be 50GB by early 2007. Sony had prototype 8-layer disks that were >200GB in capacity.

 

[Pat Lawrence]

Amazing how things change in such a short period of time!

Thanks for the info, Jeff.

Pat

 

[John Diel]

Bill,

You are correct in that Commercial DVD's are indeed pressed, This is due to the mass production systems used. Computer technology, this it was there, need to catch up in a package small enough to fit into a standard PC Case and still be able to refocus it's lens to make the second layer. Commercial production doesn't have this issue as they burn the layer in large sheets, then stamp cut them to size and "press" it between the vinyl layers. We're doing the opposite in that we're taking blank media and burning it though the vinyl layer.

The result is essentially the same. You have a DVD9 Disc in which a coimputer reads as DVD-ROM and a stand alone player reads as DVD9. The only real difference is the process by which they were made.

 

[Bill Hark]

Thanks for the help. I have found more info on dual layer or DVD9 disks. They are replicated rather than duplicated which is a process where a ?glass plate is made first. Most production companies will only do a run of 1000, rarely 500 and most require the master to be submitted on a DLT tape rather than a dual layer disk I burn at home. They are more expensive than regular DVD + or -R.

Bill Hark

 

[Jeff Snyder]

Bill,

Dual-layer DVDs (just like single-layer DVDs) can either be replicated or duplicated, depending upon whether they are "burned" or "pressed". I've never inquired into DVD duplicator (pressing), since the required quantities (through my prelim research) generally exceed anything that I'd need. Most commercial DVDs (including Hollywood movies) are pressed, not burned.

EDIT: Just for semantic purposes... I read in a couple magazines a while back that Double-Layer technically refers to DVD+R tech, while Dual-Layer refers to DVD-R technology. It's a marketing thing. I'm trying to find that mentioned in pcmag.com or another reputable site, but I can only find the difference mentioned in a ZDNet article and a CNet article, neither of which I would usually consider to be entirely reputable.

 

[Jason Hetzel]

http://www.blu-ray.com/

Check it out sometime you guys. Blu-Ray is expected to be out within the next few months here in America, and i feel it will be a major success. It will be nice backing up my hdd's on a single disc now instead of 10 dvd's :wink: