Why Not Balloons?

[Steve Miller]

Benjamin Franklin already did that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Stephen Levine]

If I remember correctly, in Twister, they used hundreds of metal balls released into the tornado and tracked by radar to show the circulation.
I believe a balloon is just too vulnerable to puncture due to the factors mentioned in previous posts.
However, hundreds of metal balls just might do the trick; especially if released in stages from different parts of the storm.

 

[Dan Robinson]

I think the "Twister" concept actually has some merit. Why not something like lightweight solid styrofoam as the probe casing? I'd imagine the essential electronics could be made lightweight enough that they would easily loft within a styrofoam casing, and the whole package wouldn't damage anything when it descended.

 

[Skip Talbot]

I'll go ahead and share the design Convective Addiction was working on since I'm pretty sure we're never going to get around to building this thing. If you get a grant to actually build this thing or something similar, bring me on board!

Design consisted of three GoPros, a Spot GPS satellite tracker, and a small data logger, enclosed in a small acrylic dome and flown under three 36 inch weather balloons. Thinking about it again, I'm not sure that dome is needed at all. The GoPros are fine exposed and the other components could be bagged or put in some foam.

Components:


Side:


Top:


Perspective:



We decided prefilling the balloons would be best. You've got to get close to the tornado to get the balloons in the tornado, and there's no way you're going to be able to fill a balloon standing in the RFD or under the tornado cyclone, or have the time to do that. The balloons should fit in a minivan though:







Weights/Prices (2011)
[TABLE="width: 600"]
[TR]
[TD]Component[/TD]
[TD]Price[/TD]
[TD]Weight[/TD]
[TD]Lifting Capacity[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]GoPro Hero Naked[/TD]
[TD]$260 x 3[/TD]
[TD]6 oz x 3[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Spot Satellite Tracker[/TD]
[TD]$270[/TD]
[TD]5 oz[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Data Logger[/TD]
[TD]$275[/TD]
[TD]3 oz[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Acrylic Dome[/TD]
[TD]$30[/TD]
[TD]8 oz[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]36" Balloon x 3[/TD]
[TD]$14 x 3[/TD]
[TD]-[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]45 cubic feet of Helium[/TD]
[TD]$3 - $6[/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[TD]36 oz[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Total[/TD]
[TD]$1403[/TD]
[TD]34 oz[/TD]
[TD]36 oz[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]


Here's the problems that make this thing really impractical though:

• You gotta get real close
  The clear air inflow east of the tornado goes into the updraft base, not the tornado
  The inflow north of the tornado might go into the wall cloud and not the tornado
  The rear inflow jet goes into the tornado, but has a downward component and is quite dangerous itself
• The balloons will pop
  Three balloons in the back of a van during a chase? Good luck with that
  Hail, debris, trees, powerlines, something is going to get in the way before you get close to the funnel
• No vertical control
  Downdrafts will send your balloon into the ground, updrafts into a featureless cloud mass before it reaches the tornado.
  You'll need the balloons to pop to get the camera probe back. They more than likely will quite quickly pop, but if they don't your expensive cameras could wind up hundreds of miles downstream.
• No stabilization
  The cameras are going to spin unless you build a rig that corrects that
  Once you get close to the tornado everything is going to be rocking and rolling.
  A gimbal might fix this, but that's lots of weight and a waterproofing nightmare, and it's $$$.

 

[Steve Miller]

Skip, bravo! This is very cool stuff. Would love someone to try this just to see what it sees from the camera(s).
Sounds like the track it will take with a simple launch into the inflow will not accomplish much for science (instrumentation placement-wise), but imagine the potential for cool pictures and/or video!

 

[Skip Talbot]

What might be an even cooler shot than into the tornado, and a lot easier to execute, is if you release the balloon NEAR but not into a stratosphere bumping huge, updraft tower. You'd have an epic shot of convection going for tens of thousands of feet, a short trip through the anvil, and then pop out on top with a huge dark blue dome above and a view of the overshooting top. Pop the balloons and send it back down.

 

[Jeff Duda]

These programs weren't run by TVN or some other group that got face time on Discovery or any other network, so you probably didn't hear about it. That doesn't mean no one else is doing it.

http://www.examiner.com/article/new-severe-weather-research-group-being-co-lead-by-cu-boulder

 

[Anders Petersson]

Hi, I was referred here by Steve Miller.
My company has developed a miniature radiosonde Windsond (http://windsond.com). Originally it was designed for hot air balloon pilots, who need a portable and reuseable system for wind measurements. It measures winds and GPS altitude, temperature, humidity and pressure... but doesn't take pictures. In a normal setting about 90% of the sondes are recovered and reused. The system should be useful in a tornado chasing scenario as the balloon is small enough to be inflated inside a vehicle. In the picture we release it through a car window. However, the sonde won't attain 5 m/s rise speed (a number mentioned previously in this thread) with a balloon of that size.


I got in contact with tornado researchers during the ISARRA meteorology conference in Norman, OK two weeks ago and hopefully they will start using Windsond. We can still offer a kit for a good price to a hobby storm chaser to try it out in this setting.