Storm Chasing And Relationships

[Susan Strom]

It's pretty late when I'm writing this so hopefully still making sense. I've been photographing that wildfire, so late on the boards tonight.

My "close encounter" was a thunderstorm I experienced in 1994. It was so violent that it created a fear shortly thereafter, compelling me to study my way out as the solution to returning to a point where I could look at storms in proper perspective. It worked you could say! Furthermore, since I was a photographer already...well, the rest is history.

This was an experience that sparked the entire chase journey for me but no one else was involved (not even there for the storm-of-my-lifetime). The responsibility and accountability for success as a chaser has always been up to me and still is to date as I am the one who is deeply compelled, desire increasing even moreso each year. This potent combination of passion and drive - it falls outside any male/female relationships or issues.

 

[Susan Strom]

Chase Posse

Shane, I totally see your point. However, I don't think it's a male/female issue. There are just some people who want to tag along and form a little posse around a serious chaser's hard-earned efforts. Any well-known, dedicated chaser will run into this, and yes, it can be annoying because it's clear that for these people that piggy-backing is their M.O., getting down and dirty with Mother Nature year after year is not.

I believe I am clear that I chase alone, but yet I am asked very often to bring others. Sometimes, people I have never met (esp since going on TV) will be quite insisting. I remember one freelance photographer in particular - never met her even once, but one day she called me at home to ask me. I believe I referred her to a storm tour group, as this was a more appropriate solution to her wanting to chase.

My exception to solo chasing is in the Plains, but only when it involves others with whom I am familiar and I know to be real chasers. Even so, I'm a lightning photographer first, and chasing styles differ so...you might pass me on the highway instead.

Some people listen and respect my wishes, some do not and keep asking to come (yet are not willing to invest anything in their own vehicles, learning process, and everything else that is needed for a successful expedition). They would rather spend their money on other things, not CBs, scanners, vehicle, weather books, conventions, etc., but still want to chase. The world doesn't work that way.

If my chase goal in this world was to socialize, run safaris and have road trip parties this would be fine. But my chase goal is professional PHOTOGRAPHY, and I simply must concentrate. When I shoot I am still as a stone, I don't even breathe because it might blur the exposure. I just can't take people along who are there just to hang out, it costs me so much productivity. This is a lesson learned from experience.

Many chasers face these questions on a regular basis but it's not a female/male issue (unless the tag-a-long wants to tag along romantically too, yet not be an active contributor to the expedition. I would question a lot of motives then). I think this is an issue of some people wanting to take the easy road into something that requires a lot of hard work and sand in the face for the rest of us.

Just for fun:
Tag-a-long's Read Me file: If you're going to chase with me, you're going to get dirty. And bring water because we'll be running the Central Deserts until 4 o'clock in the morning. Do not chase with me if you fear: snakes, spiders and scorpions. I charge $50 for cactus spine removal LOL Complete and total dead stillness will be required while shooting, in the midst of sandstorms and CGs coming down all around in the desert. Still want to come? <wink>

 

[Carrie Halliday]

I agree with Gayla on the child factor. This is why I have not done much chasing and not gone any distances to do it yet. While I have this need to chase and it is my hobby of sorts, my family always comes first. It comes before work, hobbies, needs, etc. I am down to one child at home now under 18 fulltime, but still think I need to be around as much as possible even though she is nearly 16. I didn't have these kids to be an absent parent, and with my hubby's work schedule, I am the one that needs to be around.
My philosophy is that my time will come, I am young still and will have tons of time to do what I want in the coming years. With 5 kids in the mix, even though most are grown (or think they are), there is still alot of drama that Mama needs to fix. Don't get me wrong, I do have a life beyond the kids, but they are #1 at this point. Soon I will be #1 and do what I please! It is just the way I am.
All of them are home this weekend and I still have hair. Whoever said that parenting stops or gets easier when they turn 18 is a fool. I am seeing that the hardest years on the kids is from 18-21, trying to find their path in life and a purpose to it. I have 3 boys in this range and 2 of them are still lost sheep, as far as dealing with life as an adult, learning the new rules of adulthood and mainly....the RESPONSIBILITIES.

 

[Patrick Ware]

I have 3 boys in this range and 2 of them are still lost sheep, as far as dealing with life as an adult, learning the new rules of adulthood and mainly....the RESPONSIBILITIES.

Children are a direct reflection with how they were raised and what they saw and perceived every day. As far as ever seeing them become totally independent, it will never happen. They are like boomerangs, the harder you throw them the faster they return to you, not to mention that there is always a special closeness between mothers and sons.
All one can do is pray that they will not do serious harm to themselves before a certain level of maturity sets in and takes over the decision making process. Most children stop listening to their parents after 6th grade. It is amazing however, how much smarter I become the older my children have gotten. Pretty soon, I will be the smartest person they have ever met. Funny how that works. :lol:

 

[Gayla Drummond]

Just a note about equal pay opportunities...anyone else read about Wal-Mart being sued for paying men more than women holding the same positions?

Myself, I worked my way up the 'corporate ladder', without college (I had planned to go, but frankly, getting out on my own had more of a siren call for me :lol: ), and now I own two businesses. They're small, yes, but they'll grow.

I have chased by myself, as I said, and if chasing by myself was a goal I held, I have absolutely no doubt I would be able to learn to forecast, get myself out to a storm, and bag myself some tornadoes. After all, the first 'good' tornado I ever saw, I was alone, and navigated myself to within a half mile of. 'Good' meaning a well-developed funnel on the ground, with a large debris cloud (fortunately, just dirt and vegetation).

The plain fact is, I don't currently have a big interest in learning to forecast, much to David's dismay. I just want to get out there and see/experience what's going on, be it a tornado, hail, lightning, straightline winds, whatever. I want to get photos and footage of the power of severe weather....and I don't have to learn forecasting on my own to do it, since I have someone who does it and enjoys it. My best opportunity to do what I want when it comes to chasing is to go with someone who does know and enjoy that part of chasing.

However, I'm not glued to David's side, he's not the only way I get to get out and chase. I just enjoy it much more in his company than I do alone. But any experienced chaser that needed a 2nd set of eyes and invited me to go with him or her, if I were able to go, I would.

You don't learn storm chasing, or much of anything else, by sexual osmosis, after all. Well, you can learn some things, but they don't pertain to more than yourself, your partner, and the bed. :shock: :toothy10:

Sex is all well and good, some even earn a living at it...sexual therapists, etc, but I hardly think it has much bearing on how much you know, learn, or go out chasing. I think a woman having a sexual relationship with her male chase partner is irrelevant.

Chasing boils down to just a few things....the desire to do it, the ability to learn to do it, and the financial resources to do it. *nods to Susan*

As Carrie said, for many of us who are mothers, family always comes first. For those without children, it's much easier to chase (as long as you can make arrangements about work and school, that is). For those with kids, it's much harder if you don't have a good support system in place. You want to know beyond the shadow of a doubt that your kids are safe and being well-looked after by someone you can trust. If you don't have that, you don't chase. End of report.

It's not male vs. female in the chase community, by any means. It's female vs. female, mainly because there have been females who've come onto the chasing scene and lied their tails off about how long they've been chasing, what they've seen, etc. When a woman does that, it makes all of us who do sincerely want to chase look bad. These wannabe chasers are always found out, and they retaliate by claiming male chasers don't want females chasing. When women make a name for themselves in chasing that causes any chaser hearing their name to fall down laughing, it's not to the general favor of the rest of us female chasers.

In my own experience, I've never had a male chaser treat me with anything less than respect. That may well be because I chase with David, and he knows what he's doing, or it may be because I don't try to show off what I do know by jumping into every single discussion. I am pretty quiet on chases, I offer what I'm seeing if I see something no one else seems to have noticed yet, but for the most part, I keep my mouth shut and learn from what's being said and viewed. I don't view doing so as limiting myself, as I can be quite vocal about what I think is happening if I disagree with David's assessment (and was even right, at least once, :lol.

It's all well and good to claim I could get myself to a storm, stay on it, and bag a tornado by myself. I could. *shrug* It would be something close to home, though, and that's only good to claim if it's the truth.

If I get on a storm, am chasing alone, but calling my male nowcaster every ten minutes for information, and bag something, then I didn't do it on my own....I had help. And I am not so driven by ego, or so hung up on proving girls can chase, too, that I wouldn't acknowledge the fact that I had that help, and got whatever it was because of that help.

Again, maybe I have a slightly different perspective on this. I'm the only girl out of five kids, and I've taught a couple of my younger brothers how to do stuff considered 'male things'. like changing out alternators, etc. Just because I know how to do that sort of thing doesn't mean I won't step aside and let a a guy do it....it's hard to get grease and oil out from under your fingernails! :lol:

I think sex is irrelevant to chasing. So what if you happen to sleep with your chase partner? Does that increase or inhibit your learning ability? I think not, and apparently, Susan doesn't feel that way, either.

Sex didn't make me choose to take the SKYWARN classes or get my ham radio license. Sex doesn't make me want to chase or not chase. Sex didn't teach me storm features. David did, but it wasn't at night. :lol:

I see no problem at all admitting to learning to chase from a guy, nor do I see any problem with continuing to learn about the weather or chasing from a man. I guess maybe I'm letting the sisters down with that admission, but that's where there not being a lot of female chasers fails the ones that are here.

 

[Gayla Drummond]

Re: M/F not an issue

Originally posted by Susan Strom
I agree that the learning of anything can involve consulting with experts, learning from those who know more, such as Gayla learning from David when she was new to chasing. However, she took it upon herself to absorb the knowledge he was offering and apply it in the field. Marriage is really not an issue here though, it sounds like it was Gayla who sought the knowledge and nurtured her passion for chasing on an individual level where she found meaning. David might be her coach, but has many goals and passions of his own to cultivate.
*snip*
It is up to each individual to realize their strengths and accept full accountability for achievement of their personal goals (like Melissa going to college, or Gayla learning Web design). Male/female not a factor. Priorities and the arrangement of one's life is the only factor.

Oh, I still consider myself very much new to chasing, even with several chases under my belt. Maybe I won't feel that way in five years, but I do now.

That is a very important point, that each individual has their own goals and passions. David's goals and mine mesh much of the time, be it about chasing or other things, but they aren't exactly the same, just like our need to chase isn't exactly the same. David has to chase....it's a part of him so deeply engrained that it will make him chase up until the bitter end. I respect that, but yet I don't have the chasing bug as severely. I can forego chasing if circumstances come about that prevent me from going, and as I've said in a prior post, I can support him to go chase, whether I get to go or not. We just know now not to let it get like the 2003 season, where I never got to go out once. :lol:

As for the example of my learning webdesign, yes...I was interested in that months before I even knew David existed...but then again, much of what I've learned now is a combination of trial and error and picking his brain about it....and having the proper tools to do the job.

I think we're pretty much trying to make the same point here...it doesn't matter if you learn something from a male or female, it only matters that you learn about what you want to learn about. Like webdesign, that you utilize the tools you can find.

Melissa Moon is utilizing college to attain her goals, as you pointed out.

There's nothing wrong with finding the proper tools to get a job done...it just saves a lot of aggravation to yourself.

Ultimately, it doesn't matter what sex your chase partner is, whether you chase by yourself or with a partner, who does or doesn't help you along the way...all that matters is that you challenged yourself and met/surpassed that personal challenge by the means at your disposal.

And, most importantly, that you never stop learning about anything that interests you.

 

[Susan Strom]

Gayla wrote:

I think sex is irrelevant to chasing.

I agree. Sex is a different area of life.

But to date or not to date a chaser...hmmm, still on the fence with that one. It would totally depend on the guy, his personality, intelligence, kindness, and so many other factors. I can see both Gayla’s and Mel’s point. I tried it twice in the past (dating someone who happened to be a chaser too). One turned out to be incompatible (he had a strong dislike for wilderness/the outdoors, so well, see where that one went. Chasing had actually turned out to be literally the only thing we had in common(!), so of course we went our separate ways. But you have to give something a shot, right...) and the other was nice but long distance so just became a phone thing for a couple months. I dated them because I liked their personality chaser or not, although in both cases it was nice to be with someone who "gets" the weather thing too, and who wouldn't look at me like I just landed if I slip...point and say "CG" during a thunderstorm

I probably overdo it, but I’m extremely careful about who I date. Meeting people and finding friends is easy, but I am learning that kindred spirits who (genuinely – the key word) accept adventurous, independent females come along rarely. That’s why when I meet someone I don’t hide the chasing aspect in my life or my love for desert and wilderness. I’m just not going to put on a frilly dress and pretend to be afraid of a bug just so a guy will accept me. The feminine spirit is one of strength not weakness. Yin is not lesser to Yang, they are complementary, both bringing strengths to the table. I don't know where this idea comes from that a woman has be faintly and weak, just so a guy will accept them (Disney anyone?)

all that matters is that you challenged yourself and met/surpassed that personal challenge

That’s it. Striving to achieve your personal best and nothing less.

Gayla, you're a smartie. I'm glad you make the time to contribute to the chase community.

 

[Gayla Drummond]

Originally posted by Susan Strom
Gayla wrote:

I think sex is irrelevant to chasing.

I agree. Sex is a different area of life.
*snip*
I’m just not going to put on a frilly dress and pretend to be afraid of a bug just so a guy will accept me.

all that matters is that you challenged yourself and met/surpassed that personal challenge

That’s it. Striving to achieve your personal best and nothing less.

Gayla, you're a smartie. I'm glad you make the time to contribute to the chase community.

Thanks, Susan. :wink:

Do women still do that? Pretend weakness just to attract a man? Jeebus, where've I been? :lol:

The whole sex thing is way overblown in any situation, in my opinion. Everybody does it, even those not old enough to handle it, so seriously, what's the big deal, right?

But, I had a thought about the whole chasing/relationship thing.

A chaser meeting someone, and making it very clear from the start that chasing is the most important thing in their life is screwing up their chances for a successful relationship with a non-chaser.

Falling in love should be a heady, joyous experience where nothing matters but how you feel about the other person, and how they feel about you.

To be told something like "I love you, but I love chasing more" dooms a relationship right off the bat. It immediately puts the other person at a disadvantage, in second place, and in competition with chasing for your attention.

And (don't whack me, Shane, your post was just the most convenient example), if a chaser can say to someone they have professed to love, "See ya, don't let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya" when chasing becomes an issue in a relationship, then they really didn't love the other person.

Something more along the lines of "I love you, but I have to chase" gives the chance for discussion, instead of making the significant other feel like they are 2nd best in your life.

But, even two chasers can have relationship problems because of or related to chasing...after all, NO relationship is perfect.

No one likes to feel left out, 2nd best, or in competition with something they can't possibly hope to win out over.

If it's not chasing, there's something else that takes the place of it to cause problems.

 

[Susan Strom]

Gayla wrote

Falling in love should be a heady, joyous experience where nothing matters but how you feel about the other person, and how they feel about you.

It is. But the logical side kicks in too, hoping that certain compatibilities exist so the relationship can have a future. There has to be some flexibility and meeting halfway, but realistically, those who deny or stuff away their natural authentic selves just to stay in a relationship will bring anything but joy to the table. A reed can bend, but it is still a reed, and it will always be a reed.

There has to be acceptance and compatibility, and fortunately some have found it. Only when people can live authentically and be themselves with their mates will happiness be theirs. That's why it's so hard to find I guess, so many people want someone who they feel they can "change."

Emotion is wonderful, but only part of the picture.

 

[Gayla Drummond]

Originally posted by Susan Strom
Gayla wrote

Falling in love should be a heady, joyous experience where nothing matters but how you feel about the other person, and how they feel about you.

It is. But the logical side kicks in too, hoping that certain compatibilities exist so the relationship can have a future. There has to be some flexibility and meeting halfway, but realistically, those who deny or stuff away their natural authentic selves just to stay in a relationship will bring anything but joy to the table. A reed can bend, but it is still a reed, and it will always be a reed.

There has to be acceptance and compatibility, and fortunately some have found it. Only when people can live authentically and be themselves with their mates will happiness be theirs. That's why it's so hard to find I guess, so many people want someone who they feel they can "change."

Emotion is wonderful, but only part of the picture.

Oh, definitely true....logic and clear thinking must be a part of any relationship. But, we're human, and when trying to put our 'best foot forward' so to speak, when it comes to trying to impress someone we are attracted to, we do tend to downplay our faults and flaws.

Not that I'm saying chasing is a fault. :lol:

But learning about compatibility is part of the process. Why learn about it if there's not a reason to, right? Normally an emotional reason.

And meeting halfway, that's a must, you are certainly right on that, Susan.

I have to point out, though, that it's not fair to expect the non-chasing partner to do all of the compromising when it comes to chasing, either. I think that many chasers do expect their partners to do all the compromising when it comes to that. After all, maybe they compromised about pets, or something else, right?

Like you said, it has to be a meeting halfway thing.

Obviously, all the love in the world isn't going to amount to a hill of beans if two people are just blatantly incompatible. That way just lies heartache and a bad taste in your mouth when it's all over.

If it's just minor incompatibilities, though, there's where meeting halfway comes into play, or should, if the two people involved really do care about one another.

And really, it's very hard to explain chasing...the time, money, and interest it consumes of you, to a non-chaser.
You can tell them, of course, but until they've actually gone through a chase season with you, they won't get it. Until it's actually experienced, it's just not real to them.

Unfortunately, there's not a whole lot you can do to make it real to them before that point in time, and I'm guessing that's when most relationships with non-chasers fall apart...that first season after meeting.

 

[Shane Adams]

Originally posted by GaylaDrummond
And (don't whack me, Shane, your post was just the most convenient example), if a chaser can say to someone they have professed to love, \"See ya, don't let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya\" when chasing becomes an issue in a relationship, then they really didn't love the other person.

I disagree. A person can love someone without having to make that person the focal point of their life. I don't get involved with someone romantically because I need them, but because I want them. Too many people (and I think in particular women) don't get this at all.

If I have an established life (my total dedication to chasing) and someone comes along, I will say to that person "this is what I am, this is what it is.....I'd like you to be a part of this." This isn't dooming the relationship, it's simply honesty. Maybe it seems like "doom" because it's not the classic fairytale that all women inheritly strive for (whether they themselves know it or not).

I just don't understand why not sacrificing your own personal passion is considered "dooming" a relationship. The philosophy that "all we have, all we are is each other" is close-minded and narrow IMO. People who invest 100% of themselves into a relationship put themselves in a position where they become dependent on the other person for their very identity, let alone happiness. The "shucking" of oneself (in my case - total dedication to chasing) as Gayla suggests, for the betterment of the relationship, only serves to alienate the person from knowing themselves......you change your life around for a relationship, then that relationship ends, and suddenly you find yourself not only alone and heart-broken, but asking the the question "who am I?"

This is beyond chasing, I'm just using chasing as an example. Much like David and I have talked about, this isn't a man saying "chasing is my life, you're second".....it's a man saying "chasing is a part of who I am, and I want you to be a part of me too." I think you understand exactly what I'm saying here :wink:

Jo knew coming into this thing what I was, and she accepted it. We have our moments (like any couple), but at the end of the day, we're always on the same page. Jo isn't second fiddle. Jo is number one. Chasing is a part of who I am, it can't be ranked or prioritized. I have to chase, it's in my blood. No relationship or other situation will ever change that.

So in closing, I don't think being honest with a person from the beginning is dooming the relationship. Actually, I think not sharing with the person about your passion spells doom; sooner or later the issue will arise, and then there you are. "You should've told me this from the start"


LOL, you can definitely tell this thread is mostly women. I just said in about 5 paragraphs what you gals have put into 3 pages' worth. No wonder there's 57,123 magazines for women by women :wink:

 

[Brian Brubaker]

Much earlier in this topic someone mentioned that their significant other at the time may have had a problem with them going out on chases with members of the opposite sex. I have a POV on this that at best is arguable, at worst controversial.

One of the things I've observed about male-female interaction is that over time, feelings that in the beginning didn't exist, can sometimes develop. What I'm talking about is how men and women who are "just friends",
"just co-workers", "just chase partners", or whatever can often develop feelings for each other. Now I'm not saying everyone is susceptible to this, just that human emotions, being so complex, can make us more vulnerable than we think we are.

This is why, in my opinion, it isn't wise for someone who is in a relationship to work (or play) closely with a member of the opposite sex. You see, I don't believe trust is the issue, but understanding our human falliability is. Would I trust my wife in such situations? Yes. Would she trust me? I hope so. But we understand that when you've given yourself completely to your spouse (in our case), that it isn't worth it to put ourselves in situations where our "humanness" could risk our relationship.

I don't expect many will agree with this, but I thought it was relevant to the discussion.

Fortunately, my wife would never let me go on a chase without her, but only because she is as interested in it as I am!

 

[Jay McCoy]

I will have to be one of the ones that disagree Bryan. if you are in a relationship that is based on actual love then there shouldnt be an issue.

If you truly love somebody then you are commited to them in every way. You should have the self discipline and respect of your mate too honor that commitment. if you finds yourself developing feelings for somebody else then obviously the relationship your in isnt as strong as you think.

People cheat or develope feelings for others outside of their relationship because something is missing and they are unhappy. Not because they spend time with them on the road chasing. If you are content in your marriage or BF/GF relationships then cheating isnt an issue.

 

[Melissa Moon]

Bryan,

You're probably referring to my post that I made quite a while back.

I would say that I agree with Jay about the cheating issue. Obviously, my ex boyfriend was the jealous type who did not want me hanging out with other guys. In most cases of my past, no one has had any issues with me having guy friends and hanging out with them, because they know me better than that. My ex did suspect that I would develop feelings for other guys, and this not only told me that he didn't trust me, but also that if he were the situation where he was around female friends, it is likely he would develop feelings for them (the whole takes one to know one). I was dead-right too, because he admitted to me after we broke up that he sort of had a backburner-crush on one of his friends when he and I were together. I, on the other hand, had no problem with him hanging out with whoever he wanted, and didn't have a crush on anyone while we were together.

Anyway, I disagree that spending time with someone of the opposite sex means that you will develop feelings for them. I've spent plenty of time with guys whom I am friends with, and for most of them, the thought has never crossed my mind.

 

[Gayla Drummond]

Shane, I respect your opinions.
Now, I'm gonna disagree with you on some things. :lol:

Need? Did I say 'need'?

Need and want are two very disparate creatures. I need air, food, sleep, and water....I want to be with David, I'm not going to keel over dead if I'm not with him, obviously.

Honesty dooming a relationship? Uh-uh, bud, what I was talking about was dishonesty dooming a relationship. There's a far piece between "chasing is my hobby", which is what I was told by David when we first met, to "chasing is as much a part of me as an arm or leg" which is how he verbalizes it now.

Was he dishonest 5 years ago? No, he just didn't have it explained fully to himself to put it to me in a way I'd get. I did get it, finally, I'm a little slow on the uptake at times...comes from being a parent. :lol:

And hold up there, dude. I never said anyone should 'shuck' or sacrifice a part of who they were for any relationship! :shock:
No one should totally subliminate themselves into someone else or into anything....that's called obsession, and it's unhealthy. Some obsessions that aren't gone overboard on can be worthwhile, yes, but when they cross that line....bad things follow.

What I said was 'compromise' and 'meeting halfway'...things that happen in any relationship over a variety of issues. Any healthy relationship, that is. I said that we tend to put our best foot forward when presenting ourselves to a potential mate (and others). And in doing so, we consciously or subsconciously downplay things that we think the other will find unattractive. It's not conscious dishonesty, it's human.

There are those who are members of the 'chasing is an integral part of me' group, and then there are those who are like me...I love to chase, I want to chase, I need to chase....but I will forego chasing to take care of other matters, big or small, if there is such that needs to be taken care of. If I can't find a way to get it done, or whatever, then I don't chase, no matter how badly I might want to. I won't put it off for after a chase.

Chasers are a defensive lot...I get defensive myself when someone tells me I'm crazy because I chase. But because of that, chasing ends up being the focal point of almost any argument any chaser/chaser or chaser/non-chaser couple has...and there's a solid reason for that. Most couples' top disagreements occur over money. Chasing is expensive.

There ya go. No matter what, if there's a chaser involved, it will always come down to chasing when there's a squabble going on. And it's not always the non-chasing/on hiatus chaser bringing it up, and making it a focal point, either.

David will do without a lot of things to have the funds to chase or upgrade equipment. I will, to a point. But if there's something I really want to add to my 3D library for use in my artwork, I'll spend part of my chasing funds to get it. So, I'll do without a few snacks on the road...I don't eat much, anyway, :lol:.

You are right, this does go beyond chasing, and yes, now I get what you mean exactly. I subconsiously knew it back in August, but I had too much else going on emotionally to realize it at the time. I'll just say that David made it as clear as possible that I was #1. I just failed to compute it at the time. :cry: I'm a pretty stubborn person, and when I make a decision, you can move Heaven & Earth to try to get me to change my mind, to absolutely no avail.

And Shane, hush up. Women just like to thoroughily discuss things, that's all. :wink:

Now, Bryan....you bring up a very good POV. It is true that feelings can develop between two people over time that were not there in the first place....IF there is an attraction or commonality between them to spark it in the first place. Humans are fallible....we can, and do, love more than one person at a time, and it's not always spouse, children, parents, etc that are the only members of the list.

Best example of this, human fallibility, that I can think of that's relatively harmless, is the fact that we look. Admit it. David and I can be in the store, a cute girl walks by, and he checks her out. Doesn't mean he wants her...it's just something hardwired into the human psyche. "oooh, pretty" is probably the subconscious thought in his head at the time. :lol:

Same token, we can be in the store, and there go my eyes, checking out some guy....and I know it's "oooh, pretty" going through my head.

It doesn't matter how much you love your partner, your human fallibility comes into play in certain situations....and you'll look.

Jay's points come into the picture here. You might look, but unless there's something missing in the existing relationship, you aren't going to act. Why not? Because what you have with your spouse/GF/BF/whatever is waaaaaay more important to you than a few minutes with someone who might make ya feel like a stud or hottie for that short period of time.

I'm not saying either Bryan or Jay is completely right...there are cases where familiarity breeds love and commitment, not contempt. But there are also cases where a person, no matter how tempting the fruit, refuses it, because of their personal honor to the commitment already existing, and the love they have for their significant other.

There, did that make another page for this thread?