Is this a funnel?

Joey Ketcham

I am in need of a 2nd opinion. This is a shot of one of the many tornadic storms that hit SE Kansas on Thursday. Does this appear to be a funnel cloud to you?

Now here are the details. There were multiple reports of tornadoes, multiple reports of funnel clouds. this specific cloud in question did have persistant rotation, it did decend towards the ground but never did touch.

On the other hand it doesn't appear to have a distinct wall cloud that it's attached to nor an apparent mesocyclone.

Of all the years I've been chasing, this has been the only time I have ever questioned what I've seen... what do you think?

[Broken External Image]:http://www.kschaser.com/funnel.jpg
 
I'm not seeing any funnel cloud whatsoever. Looks to me like a lowering of some sort, possibly a wall cloud or maybe just scud clouds. But no funnel cloud.
 
I also agree with no the no funnel verdict but it is a pretty nice wall cloud! Good catch Joey!
 
Aha, I also think it is a wall-cloud. Nevertheless, please look at the left of the image; there is a tail quite suspicious. Could it be a structure with rotation?
 
Yeah, a wall cloud with a suspicious looking tail. If the 'tail' were rotating, I might call it a funnel cloud if it persists, but its just not screaming 'funnel cloud' to me.
 
Looks like a mass of rising scud to me, rather than a wall cloud — the position is right for a wall cloud, but if it were one, it'd have to be almost dead going by how "open" the sky is in front of it, which would suggest the RFD was about to occlude it. It's all those near-vertical streamers of condensation around the base of it; if it were a wall cloud, I don't think they'd be there as it'd look more laminar. In that case there isn't a funnel cloud present, either.
 
What way are you facing? Are you looking north as the precip is to the east and the clear or what possibly looks like a clear slot to the west north west?
 
Originally posted by Kurt Hulst
What way are you facing? Are you looking north as the precip is to the east and the clear or what possibly looks like a clear slot to the west north west?

Thanks for the feedback everyone. I hate to doubt myself and question what I'm looking at...

As far as it being scud's, definately not that, this thing did have vigorous rotation on it and there were actually scuds when it first formed and they fed into it.....

This was looking to the northwest, back to the northeast is where the precip shaft was so it was in the right location within the storm.
 
Yeah definetly looks like a wall cloud to me, But i notice your right under power lines. Im guilty of parking near or under power lines as well, but its not safe when its lightning out. You can hear the lines zing or sizzle when electricity is discharged from a bolt. That sound always make me weary and reminds me hey i gotta move before i get zapped.
 
Originally posted by Kurt Hulst
Yeah definetly looks like a wall cloud to me, But i notice your right under power lines. Im guilty of parking near or under power lines as well, but its not safe when its lightning out. You can hear the lines zing or sizzle when electricity is discharged from a bolt. That sound always make me weary and reminds me hey i gotta move before i get zapped.

I was wondering how long it'd take for someone to notice that, yeah stupid move on my part... I was guilty of being in that "momemt" of excitement.. thankfully right after I got out, took that pic I realized and recognized my danger and moved.
 
I guess the real question is does it matter? I could care less what the difference between a rapidly rotating wall cloud and a one with a small funnel is ; )

Aaron
 
Originally posted by jketcham+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jketcham)</div>
<!--QuoteBegin-Kurt Hulst
Yeah definetly looks like a wall cloud to me, But i notice your right under power lines. Im guilty of parking near or under power lines as well, but its not safe when its lightning out. You can hear the lines zing or sizzle when electricity is discharged from a bolt. That sound always make me weary and reminds me hey i gotta move before i get zapped.

I was wondering how long it'd take for someone to notice that, yeah stupid move on my part... I was guilty of being in that "momemt" of excitement.. thankfully right after I got out, took that pic I realized and recognized my danger and moved.[/b]



My opinion is being under as far as lightning you are safer from the lightning but if there is a chance of them being blown down then this to me is more of concern.
 
Originally posted by Aaron Kennedy
I could care less what the difference between a .....

Aaron

AARRRRRGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHH! Aaron!!!!!!!

:twisted: :twisted: :evil: :evil: :twisted: :twisted:

Ahem.....and to keep it on-topic......it looks like a blocky wall cloud. There is no tail cloud as tail clouds tend to form from the precip. region and get drawn to join the wall cloud from there as in here:

[Broken External Image]:http://www.stormskies.com/May15th02.jpg

....NOT the other way around - they do not form in clear-air south of the wall cloud - that's the wrong way round. :?

KR
 
Definitely a wall cloud...and one that looks like it could have produced a tornado (if things had lined up just right). It doesn't appear to be that far from the precip core, judging from the precip at back right in the picture. It actually reminds me a lot of the lowering associated with the Rock tornado on June 12, 2004.

Also, just because a lowering is well removed from the precip core doesn't mean that it will not produce a tornado (a la aforementioned tornado). In fact, a study by Markowski/Rasmussen suggests that tornado formation may not occur until the surface mesocyclone is completely occluded (which can occur at quite a distance from the precip core).

Gabe
 
Thanks for all the feedback on this... it's rare that I have to ask questions about features so this will probably be the last for a while..

There was a lot that went on that day, many low hanging clouds so definately had to be careful.. the rotation on this was awesome! I'm suprised it actually didn't drop, it tried to a few times but didn't.
 
One thing about funnel clouds, when you see one you are usually in no doubt what you are looking at. If you are not sure then it probably isn't.
:)
 
Originally posted by Steven Williams
One thing about funnel clouds, when you see one you are usually in no doubt what you are looking at. If you are not sure then it probably isn't.

True...most funnels have a laminar appearance (relative to the wall cloud in which they are contained), so they are relatively easy to spot.

Gabe
 
Originally posted by Gabe Garfield+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Gabe Garfield)</div>
<!--QuoteBegin-Steven Williams
One thing about funnel clouds, when you see one you are usually in no doubt what you are looking at. If you are not sure then it probably isn't.

True...most funnels have a laminar appearance (relative to the wall cloud in which they are contained), so they are relatively easy to spot.

Gabe[/b]

Back in the day while watching storms with my dad, I would always ask him the classic questions..."omg dad! is that a funnel cloud?!" "Is that rotation?!"

He'd always tell me..."Trust me...if it is, you'll know"

He's right...when you see a funnel cloud, you know what you're looking at. When questionable...you usually know deep inside that it probably wasnt much to worry about.
 
I saw a perfect example of another type of vortex today - a horseshoe vortex. It was a perfectly formed white horseshoe vortex, rotating rapidly in clear air.

As I understand it, a horseshoe vortex forms from shear, this one looked about mid-levels. The shear creates a horizontally rotating tube of air in the atmosphere. Then, a vertical updraft pushes up on the mid-part of the tube, forcing the center upward and creating a horseshoe-shape, like an upside-down "U". Do I have this right?

The rotating vortex was spinning rapidly and the ends were undulating like a mini roped-out tornado. It was really cool, lasted for about 3 minutes.

Anyone catch one of these on film?
 
april 21 possible funnel I saw?

Hey Jketchem, Eric, Mike, Melanie other about the April 21 feedback
Jketchum - yours looks like a wallcloud. But I think mine might have been a funnel or some structure like it and I am curious.
Thanks for looking my April 21 images Eric.
http://members.aol.com/kcstormguy/stormsat...lattecitymo.htm
The picture was smaller because I wanted to have it to be able download on the page more easily. I do have a higher resolution pictures of it but they show pretty much what I see on my video and this. Yours is a little darker and more defined.
The very Cell or wallcloud like structure on the right and a funnel like structure or a hail core? angling from the right down . I am interested to know what this whitish angling structure was? hail corse? rain wrapped funnel or what?
Feedback appreciated. I am interested to know what this structure was.
Dr.Eric Flescher ([email protected]),Olathe, KS -Storm Satori-http://members.aol.com/kcstormguy/stormsatori/stormsatori.htm


******

Eric,

I believe we've written each other in the past through
Stormtrack.org...perhaps regarding digital cameras(?)

Anyway, I pulled one of your video screen grabs from
the other day in Platte City. I did some rough
Photoshop work on one of them in order to enhance the
detail in the cloud structure in the background.
Obviously, the low resolution and small image size
resulted in considerable noise and color shift (a
full-sized screen grab would've yielded more info) but
interesting results nonetheless. See attached jpg.


Eric Hostetter
 
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