FALSE REPORTS FROM UNEXPERIENCED CHASERS

[Paul Hadfield]

Looking up more stats on this kid, he made a tornado report on August 19th near Springfield and looking at his video (http://www.youtube.com/user/MIDSCAR1#p/a/u/1/FfAmQFHXQwo) this is absolutely no evidence. He even talks about his adventure with his "encounter" with people that lost their possessions. (http://www.youtube.com/user/MIDSCAR1#p/a/u/0/6oViPo3g0II) There was definitely a tornado, there was definitely damage.... but in his video you would have no idea and considering he made the report at the time the video was taken, it makes you wonder. He also claimed to be building a new TIV and asked Sean Casey if he could name it "TIV 4." It seems like he just signed up for Severe Studios to stream which will not be good news for them if they ever allow that. Honestly based on these videos alone they shouldn't be allowed to have Spotter Network privileges. You see this stuff all the time on Youtube and usually look the other way, but I have seen this account post numerous reports via SN and it makes me question the validity of all of them...

I've talked to this kid a few times. He's a nice guy, lots of enthusiasm, means well, a little rough around the edges, young but has potential. Dad is the one I am concerned about. Little overly excited during the May 30, 2008 event as well as December 27 and esp. considering he's behind the wheel. Kind of surprised they even published or at the very least didn't mute some of the dialogue; namely May 30. The May 13 event being referred to in the videos would be a tough call. Those storms were in the process of lining out at the IL border so could have very well had embedded meso's before becoming significantly outflow dominate as they did with time. We weren't there to really know of course but it probably isn't fair to jump to conclusions. Even after traveling the distance from Quincy to Decatur and more specifically Mt. Zion, we had significant tree damage so they still packed quite the punch. I figure this much, there are people out there with a sincere interest in being a part of the experience. They aren't going away so we have a choice, help them become better or cast them off. I'm not implying endorsement, definitely some significant mistakes being made but I know that this kid has alot of respect for the IL based crew. Can't change what's done but this is where constructive critique on their videos would probably be useful for in the future. Just sayin'...

 

[Martin North]

Perhaps Paul...he could benefit from a couple of 'educational' chase experiences with the likes of yourself...

 

[Paul Hadfield]

Perhaps Paul...he could benefit from a couple of 'educational' chase experiences with the likes of yourself...

That probably wouldn't be a good idea either, I'm still learning myself. One thing they have that I don't is technology. I'm still old school for the most part. SpotterNetwork is cool but I don't use it and just report via espotter or call things in directly. Another disadvantage to running with me is I rarely have the opportunity to go far. I'll give the kid credit for August 19. Biggest 2009 event for C IL and it went largely undocumented. I completely dropped the ball, biggest fail of my time as a chaser, never forgive myself for that one. Inappropriate perhaps to call things prematurely as they did but good in that they were able to preserve this historic day as seen from Springfield. Perhaps if they would have just kept silent, public perspective would be different.

After last post and getting into some other things, I had a thought... People blame Discovery channel and other large productions past and present as bearing responsibility for the influx of new people into our activity but I think we share a significant part of the blame. All of our easy to find amateur photos and videos posted to the internet, presented through sophisticated websites and in such a way as to express how exhilarating an experience was is cause for inspiration. We say "they need to do this" and "they need to do that" when really, we need to recognize that if we don't present our material as to be a clearly explained as possible, we run the risk of perpetuating ignorance. Case in point, on most of my YouTube clips, I try to offer a basic explanation of what is happening so that Joe non-weather geek viewer has an idea of what they are looking at. It is for me at times a bit nerve-racking because I may very well be incorrect in some descriptions which cancels my credibility among the intellectual crowd. The downside is that if I don't explain something to some degree, my SLC could be wrongly perceived and thus an improperly educated viewer is born. I'm not saying this as everyone needs to become a weather tutor but just keep in mind that people with an interest in learning will view our material for that purpose and thus we should try to accommodate to a certain degree. Who is not to say that the people who annoy you guys on SN with their mistakes weren't inspired by your own handiwork in the first place?

 

[Kory Hartman]

Re: MIDSCAR

...He also claimed to be building a new TIV and asked Sean Casey if he could name it "TIV 4." It seems like he just signed up for Severe Studios to stream which will not be good news for them if they ever allow that...

Are we supposed to do background and YouTube checks on everyone who applies for a streaming account now?

I've only watched one of the videos linked above and I saw a family excited about *something* in the dark. I didn't hear them call it in to NWS.

Are we just calling out random newbies now for fun? (question not directly posed to Danny)

Kory

 

[JF Massicotte]

There are many newbies (and I'm still one of them). There are a lot of footage like this on youtube and I suggest those who are concerned about them that they write to them with some positive advice about what they can do to improve their chasing experience. This is, in my opinion, the best way to improve the behavior of 'noob' chasers and lower the number of false/incorrect/unjustified reports.

If you are not willing to take your time to help newbies then don't complain about them. Writing to them takes 2 minutes and can drastically change the way they behave and doing this can improve their chasing experience (and yours). There are a lot of ways this can be done and publicly calling them yahoos will probably not give the best results. From my experience only a very small proportion will continue acting like 'yahoos' after being in relation with other chasers.

 

[Martin North]

I admire anyone who is keen and committed. I hope it works out for him...but he really does need coaching and retrained as a spotter (from the evidence I've seen).

I had to learn the hard way without radar, etc. I read lots of books and studied hard for years before chasing. I must admit the advent of the internet opened a plethora of literature and information available to me.

I agree a lot with David Drummond....you don't even have to know anything about storms (or the structure of) anymore to chase them. You can bale out there with your GRL3 and watch where all the chasers are converging...and converge there yourself.

 

[Adam Lucio]

The problem with trying to point out to a new person what they're doing wrong is they always snap back at you. These days its all offense-defense with people. Nobody knows how to take constructive criticism. Ive seen a few of the comments on his youtube where such things have occurred. You cant teach someone who already thinks they know everything.

I myself don't have the patience to deal with those kind of people - props to those who do. I love to teach and help people but I have zero tolerance for those who are going to snap back at every helpful remark that is made.

 

[Danny Neal]

Again this isn't a witch hunt for newbies. This is a kid I know of from Illinois whose antics I have seen in person with his obnoxious use of a full lightbar no where around a storm. On May 13th, just by watching the video you can clearly see these are RAINSHAFTS. Point is he can't tell the difference between rainshafts and tornadoes. I didn't get to see if he made a report on the 13th or not. I, like nearly anyone chasing that day, were experiencing Kirksville and Edina supercells and tornadoes. I did not chase on the 19th and as I was reading the tornado reports coming in from various chasers, I noticed he made a tornado report and stated he was very close to it. Naturally knowing of him already I wanted to see his video. He posted it and as you may or may not have seen it was brutal. I did not simply just look him up because I was bored and felt like firing shots at someone. It was something I was meaning to do when this thread was first started. I didn't mean for you to take it personally Kory, it was more of a heads up to know what you are dealing with. Honestly, Chris isn't all that off, I think he thinks he is farther along than he is. I will send him a message via youtube later and see what type of reponse I get back. I don't like burning bridges between people and will attempt to help him out witht the basics. I know he is having fun but in those instances where he is making reports, it can be quite the pain in the ass. To repeat again: I have seen him report in the past and looking at his videos and the demeanor and logic his family and him use, you can see why I brought it up.

 

[Kory Hartman]

He must have passed the SpotterNet test

 

[Danny Neal]

He must have passed the SpotterNet test

It's not hard nowadays C'mon let's call a horse a horse. Watch all his videos and if you can tell me he doesn't need training or more help then I will retract my statements and fully support his "TIV 4"

 

[Paul Hadfield]

Again this isn't a witch hunt for newbies. This is a kid I know of from Illinois whose antics I have seen in person with his obnoxious use of a full lightbar no where around a storm. On May 13th, just by watching the video you can clearly see these are RAINSHAFTS. Point is he can't tell the difference between rainshafts and tornadoes. I didn't get to see if he made a report on the 13th or not. I, like nearly anyone chasing that day, were experiencing Kirksville and Edina supercells and tornadoes. I did not chase on the 19th and as I was reading the tornado reports coming in from various chasers, I noticed he made a tornado report and stated he was very close to it. Naturally knowing of him already I wanted to see his video. He posted it and as you may or may not have seen it was brutal. I did not simply just look him up because I was bored and felt like firing shots at someone. It was something I was meaning to do when this thread was first started. I didn't mean for you to take it personally Kory, it was more of a heads up to know what you are dealing with. Honestly, Chris isn't all that off, I think he thinks he is farther along than he is. I will send him a message via youtube later and see what type of reponse I get back. I don't like burning bridges between people and will attempt to help him out witht the basics. I know he is having fun but in those instances where he is making reports, it can be quite the pain in the ass. To repeat again: I have seen him report in the past and looking at his videos and the demeanor and logic his family and him use, you can see why I brought it up.

If you know him and certainly better than I then by all means, cancel anything I said. I only had a good experience thus far hence compelled to offer something arbitrary. In his Springfield video towards the end where you get a glimpse of a lowered something, I'm pretty sure it was the same tornado in this pic. They were extremely lucky to turn as they did and not get bamboozled. That part is what bothered me most but I will give them props for acknowledging their ignorance. The only bad reporter I recall from around here was that dude with the sooped up ride who caused all the problems back on 10/18/07 around the Ogden area.

 

[Danny Neal]

If you know him and certainly better than I then by all means, cancel anything I said. I only had a good experience thus far hence compelled to offer something arbitrary. In his Springfield video towards the end where you get a glimpse of a lowered something, I'm pretty sure it was the same tornado in this pic. They were extremely lucky to turn as they did and not get bamboozled. That part is what bothered me most but I will give them props for acknowledging their ignorance. The only bad reporter I recall from around here was that dude with the sooped up ride who caused all the problems back on 10/18/07 around the Ogden area.

Paul,

I agree with your post. I never talked to them personally except over youtube. I will admit I was a bit of a douche. I have seen them out in field and always say who the.....oh wait nvm. Like I said I will make an effort once I get home to see what's up. My only concern was with them not knowing what they are seeing or reporting. I think its great the family can all bond, reminds me of my dad and brother when we all went out. Maybe I can send him an invite to Stormtrack and welcome him into "our" world. I really am not some grumpy ass**** I make myself out to be, I am just really passionate about chasing and want people to be accurate. He gets that excited over nothing, I can't imagine the pure joy he would experience . I guess the question is......how do you go about telling someone that what they think they are seeing, isn't what they are seeing.

 

[Martin North]

To be fair Danny...if you make a genuine attempt to offer some kind of coaching (or assistance) to him...you are to be commended.

 

[Danny Neal]

To be fair Danny...if you make a genuine attempt to offer some kind of coaching (or assistance) to him...you are to be commended.

I just got home from work and am typing up my message to him now. It all depends on the attitude he takes towards my criticism/advice. If he is standoffish and feels like he has all the answers then what more can I do....Based on his comments to others on Youtube I have a feeling he wants to learn and is looking for somebody(s) to teach him. If you watch his June 7th video, once (it) hits the fan he does say "Follow them they know what they are doing.)

I feel like an ass for publicly bashing him without a reply from him. I don't want to break up the family thing, but he does need more direction and perhaps to tag along on a real coordinated chase with someone (whether its me or somebody else).

Lord knows I am not the best chaser and don't even consider myself as a great chaser. But I love to teach and help wherever I can and this looks like a great opportunity. We will see where this goes.....

 

[Paul Hadfield]

but he does need more direction and perhaps to tag along on a real coordinated chase with someone (whether its me or somebody else).

Ooooooooor maybe not... I just hollered at him via YouTube to connect on Facebook. He replied and as it turns out, guy and his crew have a whole operation going on. He never mentioned this to me otherwise I wouldn't have said a word. Still scraping my jaw off the floor... at least I was right about being enthusiastic

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Midwest-Storm-Chasers-and-Researchers/78453027433