Chaser convergence- getting even worse.

[JamesCaruso]

Even IF the data were charged for (and I agree with the posts saying this cannot and/or should not be done), the cost would be immaterial relative to the other costs of chasing so I don’t see how it could be a deterrent.

 

[Sean Ramsey]

Even IF the data were charged for (and I agree with the posts saying this cannot and/or should not be done), the cost would be immaterial relative to the other costs of chasing so I don’t see how it could be a deterrent.

I'm kind of having fun with this so bear with me. I believe you are a chasecationer correct? Would you purchase model data for $600 in order to spend a week or two on the plains to have a good handle on where/when to be? Or would you forego the cost and simply play it by SPC outlooks or whatever other data you could scrounge up and still come out to the plains knowing it would be quite a bit tougher (other than following dots on Radarscope, another problem for another day) without hi-res models, NAM, etc?.

This really isn't about the cost, it's about removing the ease of it all (which still isn't easy!)

 

[Will Campbell]

The big question I think everyone needs to step back and ask is how many times has convergence significantly affected your chase? For me, it's been almost never. And I'm right there with you all most of the time. The convergence fears have always been around. There are examples in the old ST print edition archives as early as 1988.

For those who weren't aware, I maintain a web site dedicated to this subject here which includes full-day timelapses from my 4-way dashcam setup of every chase I embark on in the Great Plains:

The difference between storm chasing and spotting?

People gotta have something to bitch about...agree with you almost 100%. Chaser convergance directly affected me twice and both times were because my planning sucked ass. May 10 and May 19 2010.

 

[Jeff Duda]

Staff note
Okay, folks, the conversation here has really digressed away from the topic of the thread, so I'm going to end the conversation related to paying for weather data. If you'd like to discuss the issue of restricted weather data, start a new thread.

 

[Sean Ramsey]

I agree it has gone down a rabbit trail that I didn't mean for it to go down. But, I believe discussing solutions (real or hypothetical) is much more constructive than merely complaining about it. It's only our safety that's at stake.

 

[Quincy Vagell]

Another thing I’d like to see is stats on or maybe a heat map of when/where chaser convergence is the worst. I think we can assume it is worst in the KS/OK/TX area in May, but where else does it peak? Maybe in eastern CO when threats are close to Denver?

Also, how quickly does convergence drop off in June? It’s probably a function of how far north and how late into the month.

I wonder, too, if this active stretch keeps going on, if we’ll see numbers fall off quicker than usual in June if some chasers run low on money for gas and such. I don’t think it’ll be a big factor, but it might still affect convergence a bit.

 

[Jeff Duda]

Another thing I’d like to see is stats on or maybe a heat map of when/where chaser convergence is the worst. I think we can assume it is worst in the KS/OK/TX area in May, but where else does it peak? Maybe in eastern CO when threats are close to Denver?

If you're up on Python and Git and want to combine the data yourself, someone has made a script for that. See

https://twitter.com/x/status/1130562139876413440

 

[James K]

I moved out of Denver cause traffic was awful... one of a few reasons, but that was a topper.
And to answer your question, ever sit in that traffic with a Supercell coming at you?

I live outside city limits (thankfully LOL) but still reasonably close.

-----
Years ago I did get caught up in a severe thunderstorm (don't know if it was a supercell or not, and ofcourse no tornadoes). Some of the heaviest rain & hail I've ever seen. It brought I25 to a complete standstill, that one was honestly a bit scary to be out in. (luckily the hail didn't get too big)

 

[TJKLECKNER]

Just watch the bad driver stop right in the road

 

[JamesCaruso]

Saw this headline this morning, eerie parallels to our own hobby:

Everest traffic jam creates lethal conditions for climbers
Two mountaineers have died on Mount Everest after crowds of people became stuck in a queue leading to the summit of the world's highest mountain.

Everest traffic jam creates lethal conditions for climbers

Two mountaineers have died on Mount Everest after crowds of people became stuck in a queue leading to the summit of the world's highest mountain.

www.cnn.com

 

[TJKLECKNER]

Yeah, my next chase vehicle will either be a food truck, or a school bus. Time to start selling tickets on chaser buses....alot safer to have a bus of 70 chasers, versus an additional 70 cars on the road 　 Food truck would strike it rich on high risk days

 

[Warren Faidley]

I've said this before, I believe we are evolving into the Idiotozoic Era of chasing where we will see an average of 1-2 deaths per year. There have already been some very close calls this year, when chasers survived because the circulation ended or weakened right before impact. This is fueled by the desire to drive into the actual vortices, not just to enjoy the show. The time is coming when a first responder crew is killed or injured responding to an idiot-caused accident. Then we will see how the public reacts when manslaughter charges and / or civil complaint is filed. So sad how this once enjoyable hobby has become a circus.

 

[Billy Faletti]

This will probably not sit well with a lot of people, but I would wager chaser jams like the one near Mangum on Monday are not just annoying, but completely unacceptable. This was a particularly extreme case, but I'm not sure there's an excuse for potentially thousands of people to be creating such a major hazard for locals/emergency management. I'm not saying this is every chase or even close to it (we know for a fact that it isn't), but the fact that this has happened at all is a problem, and anyone who chases these kinds of high-end days in this region is partially to blame (myself included). I don't even care about the annoyance. It's irrelevant. We all risk busting every time we chase and shouldn't complain that convergence makes us miss tornadoes. The bigger issue here is unnecessary hazards for people who aren't involved. Considering this, I'll likely never chase a major event there again.

 

[Quincy Vagell]

I know there was a joke about buses, but it's too bad that carpooling wasn't a more realistic option. I thought about it. A lot of chasers already go in groups. Then there are logistical challenges, as where do you leave cars and then as you chase, you're probably going to end up far away from where the vehicle(s) were left. Some people have jobs/families/etc. to come home to, as many go in different directions after a chase is over. Sure, it is safer to travel in a group than by chasing alone, but then you'd have to consider, how much do you trust the driver in a potentially dangerous situation?

I will do my part, which isn't much. In a chase, if there are side/dirt roads, I am almost exclusively going to use those roads. It's hard when there's only one or a few passable roads. I'll also be favoring secondary and/or sleeper targets more than ever before.

 

[Alex Elmore]

I've been chasing in the Plains since Tuesday, and I have come to the conclusion that the root this issue most of the time isn't chaser amounts, but just poor driving. Large amounts of chasers just exacerbate the instances of poor driving. This could be folks who are naturally bad drivers or are driving poorly because they are trying to multi-task while moving. I have yet to encounter more than roughly 12 chasers in an area at once, but even small amounts have given me numerous headaches while driving. I've come upon numerous chasers driving 10-15 mph below speed limits on flat, straight, clear roads. Each time there was no storm immediately near, so I'm not sure the reason for the slow speeds. I've had chasers break suddenly in front of me, pull out in front of me, turn around in front of me, block roads, etc. These instances occur in isolated areas with very few others around. No surprise, a lot of people just suck at driving and do not maintain situational awareness. You throw more of these types of people into more stressful situations with more people around, and what you get is the accidents, near misses, and slow downs that lead to long lines of chasers that we see on big days. Obviously even if every chaser drove properly and sanely, convergence would still happen in instances with bottleneck road networks and single storms.