09L: Hurricane Ike

[Juston Drake]

Well, if I were repeatedly having similar grossly negative issues with law enforcement on my chases, and other storm chasers were reporting a completely opposite experience, I might start looking at what the common denominator is in each incident.

Having been with Simon on several hurricanes chases now, I can tell you that there is only one common denominator with each incident........and that is the cops were acting like ***holes. Like Simon stated earlier, not all of the cops we have encounted were bad cops, but some of them were. Most of them were some small town local police that finally felt like they had something to do in life and went on power trips. And again like he said ealier, we have had this problem in several different chases now. There also seems to be a concensus here that it is ok for police to start acting crazy because they might not have gotten any sleep or their houses probably got destroyed. That is just rediculous. If they are stupid enough to build their house in an area that is vulnerable to hurricanes and it gets destroyed, that is their fault.....plain and simple. Nobody made them get a house on the beach but themselves. So there is NO EXCUSE for them to be taking their frustrations out on somebody else for their own stupidity. Also any police officer who can't handle the stress of dealing with this kind of situation needs to follow this saying, "if you can't handle the heat, stay out of the kitchen." Again i'll reiterate, most cops we dealt with were cool, but there were some that were clearly on power trips. And I'll second the opinion that the worst thing we had to worry about were bad cops.

 

[Jay McCoy]

I am just wondering then why with so many chasers on these hurricanes that nobody eles had had issues with "bad cops"? It might just be perception. Maybe they feel that nobody should be in a disaster area that isnt involved in active rescues or they are just trying to do their job in keeping everybody out of certain areas. I am sure with their communications and command structures they know whats going on more then media or chasers when it comes to hazards left by the storm. Yes we know more about the storm itself most of the time but not whats going on afterward. I read Warren's, and David's, and Tim's, and Stu's reports and none of them had any issues even when told no. I know when I chased Rita we had no issues and the cops were friendly and professional. A few made us turn when we tried to go certain places but that was because of dangerous conditions like a bridge out or road being blocked and we had no problem with that. Its all about attitude and perception.

Just seems wierd nobody else had had these issues. And by the sound of the post it seems you or your family has had some personal bad experiences away from chasing and think any cop who doesnt allow you to do whatever is on a "power trip" but that again is just a perception. As you said....""some police have a shoot first ask questions later mentallity and until you've witnessed it yourself, or had friends or family fall victim to it then you have nothing to say.""

Not trying to attack or anything just giving my perception of the argument. People are quick to blame cops when they are given orders contrary to their wishes. I see it every day and even get lip service myself from people when I tell them to turn or find another route when working traffic control.

I wont even get much into Juston's post which speaks for itself about attitude. Saying cops are "taking it out" on them cause they lost their house and they cant deal with stress cause they tell you you cant go a certain way.. uuhhmm ok. I think I can see where they are coming from having to deal with attitudes like that. You know you do not have the "right" to be in a disatsre area even with media passes and are there only by the graciousness of the authorities so be thankfull they let you stay and take video/pics.

 

[Tim Marshall]

Rdale indicated that IKE radar data archive are available at: http://mesonet.tamu.edu/products/
Does anyone know how I would go about opening the GRLVL2 files?

TM

 

[W. Grant Dade]

Has anyone found any satellite photos of Ike’s actual storm surge? I think I remember after Katrina and Rita being able to find some before and after satellite photos.

Thanks

 

[Heidi Farrar]

About 180,000 people in Arkansas were without power yesterday -- myself included! The eye came over us at around 5:30 yesterday morning. Overall, we didn't experience more than 45MPH winds at my place, but there were massive amounts of trees down throughout northeast AR and southern MO. Gusts over 60 MPH were recorded in a few areas. We lost power just before 7:00 yesterday morning and it was out until about 8:00 this morning. We had been told it could be several days, so it was nice to get it back before we had to start thinking about drastic measures to save frozen food!

There was one fatality when a tree fell on a trailer a few counties east of here. There were a lot of reports of trees down on homes, actually. KAIT-8, Jonesboro has several stories on the event.

 

[Angie Norris]

Some things to keep in mine regarding chasers, disaster situations and LEOs...we're visitors in their area and therefore extra citizens for them to worry about. It's their job to protect lives and property (or in some cases what's left of property). They are human like the rest of us and may not have much if any experience dealing with catastrophic situations.They might have lost property or family members or have no idea if their families or property are safe. Some may respond to high stress situations well while others may go into "power trip" mode. Keep in mind that a good majority of the folks that local LEOs deal with are not the good, law abiding citizens but idiots and other unsavory types. You make their job a lot easier by simply doing what they say and respond politely to them (haven't we discussed this before?). They may know of hazards that you don't and they are simply trying to keep you out of trouble (as well as lessening their work load). What does it hurt to say "Thank you, officer" and maybe add something like "Take care"? You make their job easier and maybe add the only kind words they hear in a very bad situation.

 

[Lou Ruh]

Some things to keep in mine regarding chasers, disaster situations and LEOs...we're visitors in their area and therefore extra citizens for them to worry about. It's their job to protect lives and property (or in some cases what's left of property). They are human like the rest of us
...

Some may respond to high stress situations well while others may go into "power trip" mode.

...

You make their job a lot easier by simply doing what they say and respond politely to them (haven't we discussed this before?). They may know of hazards that you don't and they are simply trying to keep you out of trouble (as well as lessening their work load).

I'm not sure this dicussion is really in the right forum section any more, but ...

I am in a position to see things from both sides, since I am in a state that has "Fire Police" (a part of the volunteer fire department who are tasked with preventing traffic from entering dangerous areas due to fires or otherwise). The vast majority of people accept that we're there for safety reason, and abide by the temporary restrictions. If someone has a valid need to cross the roadblock (such as living in a residence that is still in a safe location) they will be allowed, but, as long as it is still safe for him/her to do so.

However, as nice as I try to be, there are still folks who insist that they do have a valid reason, but, in the interest of their safety, I can't let them through. I have been called all sorts of names while doing this. It is not an easy job and you really can't please everyone.

That being said, I can say that, without exception, I have never had a problem with a LEO when out chasing. I have been let through a roadblock in the northern Texas panhandle because I was a chaser (I still have trouble believing that one ... the conversation was something like (after peering in the window and seeing the computer screen with the radar plot up) "Storm Chasers, eh? Who are you with", "Uh ... independent" (since I really didn't quite know how to answer that ), (yelled to the officer blocking the road) "Storm Chaser ... "Independent" ... "Let em through". I have had an officer stop me twice, the first time to give me a warning for speeding and the second time a mile later to let me know that he got a reports that storms were going severe not too far from where we were. That's just two examples.

 

[John Farley]

An article on the St. Louis Post-Dispatch is reporting 15 fatalities related to Ike in Missouri, Arkansas, Indiana, and Ohio. There were likely 3 fatalities in the St. Louis area, 1 due to a falling branch and 2 swept away by floodwaters on River De Peres (one body found, the other person missing but unlikely to be found alive). Most of the area got 3-5 inches of rain with locally as much as 7 inches, and high wind hit the southern and southeastern part of the metro area, with a gust of 61 mph recorded at Scott AFB. I can't ever remember a tropical system having this much impact in the STL area.

 

[Sean Mullen]

Having been with Simon on several hurricanes chases now, I can tell you that there is only one common denominator with each incident........and that is the cops were acting like ***holes. Like Simon stated earlier, not all of the cops we have encounted were bad cops, but some of them were. Most of them were some small town local police that finally felt like they had something to do in life and went on power trips. And again like he said ealier, we have had this problem in several different chases now. There also seems to be a concensus here that it is ok for police to start acting crazy because they might not have gotten any sleep or their houses probably got destroyed. That is just rediculous. If they are stupid enough to build their house in an area that is vulnerable to hurricanes and it gets destroyed, that is their fault.....plain and simple. Nobody made them get a house on the beach but themselves. So there is NO EXCUSE for them to be taking their frustrations out on somebody else for their own stupidity. Also any police officer who can't handle the stress of dealing with this kind of situation needs to follow this saying, "if you can't handle the heat, stay out of the kitchen." Again i'll reiterate, most cops we dealt with were cool, but there were some that were clearly on power trips. And I'll second the opinion that the worst thing we had to worry about were bad cops.

Perpective is everything. I imagine a post like this from some LEO forum....

Having been with my partner on several severe weather situations now, I can tell you that there is only one common denominator with each incident........and that is the chasers were acting like ***holes. Like xxx stated earlier, not all of the chasers we have encountered were bad chasers, but some of them were. Most of them were some ___(couldn't think of a term) that finally felt like they had something to do in life and went on power trips. And again like he said earlier, we have had this problem in several different severe weather situations now. There also seems to be a consensus here that it is ok for chasers to start acting crazy because they might not have gotten any sleep or they saw houses get destroyed. That is just ridiculous. If they are stupid enough to go into an area that is vulnerable to hurricanes, destruction, and resulting inconvenience, that is their fault.....plain and simple. Nobody made them go there but themselves. So there is NO EXCUSE for them to be taking their frustrations out on somebody else for their own stupidity. Also any chaser who can't handle the stress of dealing with this kind of situation needs to follow this saying, "if you can't handle the heat, stay out of the kitchen." Again I'll reiterate, most chasers we dealt with were cool, but there were some that were clearly on power trips. And I'll second the opinion that the worst thing we had to worry about were bad chasers. Especially the ones with light bars.

I really don't mean this as a personal attack on anyone; sometimes stressful situations don't bring out the best in people, and we need to cut each other some slack.

"I look down at the street and see all these people in costume and then I see two cops, and I'm thinking, 'Are those really cops, or just people dressed up in cop uniforms?'
"Then it occurred to me, that's what cops are."--Stephen Wright

Sean

 

[Darren Addy]

Perpective is everything. I imagine a post like this from some LEO forum....
**snippage**
And I'll second the opinion that the worst thing we had to worry about were bad chasers. Especially the ones with light bars.

LOL

"I look down at the street and see all these people in costume and then I see two cops, and I'm thinking, 'Are those really cops, or just people dressed up in cop uniforms?'
"Then it occurred to me, that's what cops are."--Stephen Wright

Sean

It's Steven Wright, but that is a great line.

 

[Mike Peregrine]

The debate concerning what to do about people who stay during a hurricane is all over the place. Here's a local blog on the subject.

 

[rdale]

Rdale indicated that IKE radar data archive are available at: http://mesonet.tamu.edu/products/
Does anyone know how I would go about opening the GRLVL2 files?

Drag them into your Level II viewer, GRLevel2, GR2AE, or the free NCDC one.

 

[Darren Addy]

Mobile morgue en route to Galveston as search continues — Five dead, but thousands of homes still to be searched

The numbers are expected to rise as the waters recede and searchers are able to cover more areas, she said. Search teams also were being sent to the Bolivar Peninsula for the first time.

 

[Dennis Sherrod]

CNN and other networks have been showing a lot of aerial views today of the Bolivar areas and northeastward toward Louisiana. Initial estimates stated that probably at least 80% of the structures have been totally destroyed. It has also been stated several times that this area and the devastation was the exact reasoning for the strong wording used in the warnings.

 

[Alex Goldstein]

Does anyone have any idea of what kind of fatalities we still may be facing? I mean, it seems that fatalities have been thankfully low so far, but how much is there still left to explore? How much of these coastal areas are still untouched by search and rescue?