Radar in Stinnett, TX?

[Jay McCoy]

Woodward is about 50 miles from the Vance AFB -88D. That is prime coverage (i.e., close but outside the clutter).

Except due to terrain much of NW Oklahoma is not covered well by Vance. That area along with the extreme NE panhandle are at the limits of KAMA and KDDC so we dont see much in the way of lower level shear etc.. Same as with the far NW panhandle into NE New Mexico and SE colorado.

 

[Jeff Duda]

Except due to terrain much of NW Oklahoma is not covered well by Vance. That area along with the extreme NE panhandle are at the limits of KAMA and KDDC so we dont see much in the way of lower level shear etc.. Same as with the far NW panhandle into NE New Mexico and SE colorado.

Among such radar gaps, the one in the NE TX PH is pretty mild in comparison to the one in W OK PH, SE CO, SW KS etc.

 

[Nick Smith]

I haven't heard any update on this, but last year the NWS was looking into the possibility of expanding the existing radar network (up to 13 radars) and also replace obsolete parts on the existing radars.

https://www.fbo.gov/index?s=opportu...0111b48d54465d7ce65e41be719&tab=core&_cview=0

 

[Jeff Duda]

I would like to see CASA (3cm) or a 5cm radar (much less expensive than an -88D 10 cm radar) supplemental network started to plug some of these holes in areas with poor coverage and/or along major transportation corridors with poor coverage (I-15; Powder River Basin).

Mike

This was illuminated in a BAMS article last fall. The article discussed the feasibility of essentially replacing the role of the current WSR-88Ds with a CONUS-wide CASA network. Unfortunately in the article the authors calculated that it would require around 10,000 units to fully cover the CONUS. However, they are cheaper, and there would be multi-Doppler coverage CONUS-wide.

 

[Bart_Comstock]

Among such radar gaps, the one in the NE TX PH is pretty mild in comparison to the one in W OK PH, SE CO, SW KS etc.

Lets not forget the one around Kirksville, MO either.

 

[John Wetter]

This probably doesn't need to turn into another "where do we need gap filler" threads, but I'm still stumped by the need for a radar closer to Woodward, OK when it is 63 miles from VNX. That's practically perfect coverage... That 45-60 mile area is just what you want.

As far as gap fillers, we'll likely need to see something fairly major change going forward to get it to really happen. Perhaps if a major delay comes up with MPAR development the case could be made?

 

[Chris Nuttall]

This probably doesn't need to turn into another "where do we need gap filler" threads, but I'm still stumped by the need for a radar closer to Woodward, OK when it is 63 miles from VNX. That's practically perfect coverage... That 45-60 mile area is just what you want

Some of the appeal of Woodward is that it's a "centralized, major" city for the radar gap in question. Specifically, the gaps affecting far western Oklahoma, the extreme NE TX Panhandle, and much of Beaver County in the OK Panhandle. Logistically speaking, it's an easily accessible location. Would it necessarily have to be right outside the city limits? Of course not. However, you could think of it more as a generalized area.

The three gaps I'm familiar with the most are the one mentioned above, extreme SE CO/NE NM/W OK Panhandle, and the infamous northern Missouri hole. I know there are some others out there, but even if one of these three were filled, it would be a great step.

 

[John Wetter]

The three gaps I'm familiar with the most are the one mentioned above, extreme SE CO/NE NM/W OK Panhandle, and the infamous northern Missouri hole. I know there are some others out there, but even if one of these three were filled, it would be a great step.

Sure it would be a great step to fill any gap, but it's hard to start the fight with a city that's 60 miles away from a radar... Starting with the NE Missouri hole, or how about Pierre, SD, a state capital that is no closer than 105 miles from ANY radar the NWS has!

 

[Jay McCoy]

Sure it would be a great step to fill any gap, but it's hard to start the fight with a city that's 60 miles away from a radar... Starting with the NE Missouri hole, or how about Pierre, SD, a state capital that is no closer than 105 miles from ANY radar the NWS has!

Using that argument.. OKC is only about 75-80 miles from Enid so why do they both have radars??

Distance doesnt always mean good coverage. Albuquerue has a radar at its NWS but it cant see anything to the east due to a mountain range 20 miles east of the site. The Vance AFB site also has a gap near Woodward due to terrain so there is a big hole in west and NW Oklahoma which is prime tornado country. DDC, FDR, and AMA are too far off to give good low level returns. Too appease you we will drop Woodward and say Arnett or Shattuck

I agree one of the worst is the Clayton gap (NW panhandle, SE Co. west Ok panhandle, NE NM). That would also help enhance ABQ's coverage. Some other places have gaps but not near as much need for nexrad coverage since they dont have the type of wx that tornado alley does.

 

[rdale]

Now that this thread is completely OT Didn't someone post a table/image related to lack of coverage versus population? That'd be nice to have.

Plus it might provide "some" reasoning for the radar going into Washington state before anywhere else.

 

[Brandon Goforth]

Except due to terrain much of NW Oklahoma is not covered well by Vance. That area along with the extreme NE panhandle are at the limits of KAMA and KDDC so we dont see much in the way of lower level shear etc.. Same as with the far NW panhandle into NE New Mexico and SE colorado.

Exactly, the area south and southwest of Woodward is TERRIBLY hidden from the Vance site. IMO, we really need one put up in Arnett, OK...really bad.

 

[Jim Tang]

SE OK/NE TX/SW AR is pretty bad. So is SE AR and area around Wadena, MN (as we painfully saw last month). Agree about Kirksville, MO, Pierre, SD, and Boise City, OK gaps. Regarding radars that fail to serve their purpose, VNX is especially annoying - data from areas to the west, where it would serve as an important gap-filler, is tainted by terrain; to the north / east, ICT and TLX already provide more than sufficient coverage. Holloman AFB, NM has a similar problem - to the east, where a gap exists, data is disrupted due to mountains; to the west / south, El Paso already provides sufficient coverage.

I believe Tim Vasquez posted a radar coverage map a few years ago. SE TX is also has quite a radar hole.

 

[Kory Hartman]

Here is what that radar image looks like.

That feed is a (crude) screen stream of Baron Threat Net...