How rare are double tornadoes?

[Rob Strunk]

I understand that double tornadoes are fairly rare. I don't really mean multiple vortex tornadoes. I have seen videos of one large tornado with satellite tornadoes. That isn't what I'm asking about. I am asking about actual double tornadoes. After seeing the picture of the double twisters at Elkhart Indiana on the Palm Sunday outbreak, I am very curious, has this type of double tornado ever been captured on video or even still shots otherwise? I can't seem to find any others that even come close to rivaling that tornado. That has to be the most intimidating tornado picture I have ever seen. I'd like to see other pictures or video of similar events if they are available.

 

[MatthewCarman]

I think the most tornadoes ever seen at one time is six but I don't remember where I read that from. There has been video I believe of double vortices on the ground at the same time in Texas and I know of an old video of one from Iowa but I can't find that video anymore. On April 13, 2006 there 3 confirmed tornadoes on the ground at the same time near Muscatine. Warren Faidley has a good picture of double vortices on the ground near Dimmitt, Texas in June of 1995 but they were weak. On April 11, 1965 James R. Weyer took the only photograph authenticated by experts of luminous tornadoes. (Unless that has changed since 2003) The two tornadoes were on the ground at the same time near Toledo, Ohio. He was poking his head out of his bathroom window to take a picture of lightning and did not see the tornadoes until the film was developed. Here is the picture: http://books.google.com/books?id=S1MEAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA43&lpg=PA43&dq=James+R.Weyer&source=bl&ots=i9wwQnEAvt&sig=yvp8Nb0HJ1kUWvbRWfuZYy21AEg&hl=en&ei=Zy2wS-v9IYfENpHO7bQO&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=9&ved=0CCYQ6AEwCA#v=onepage&q=James%20R.Weyer&f=false These tornadoes occurred on the same day as the Palm Sunday tornadoes. Some scientists believe "ball lightning" is associated with luminous tornadoes.

 

[Skip Talbot]

http://www.noaanews.noaa.gov/stories2005/images/tornado-palmsunday04-11-1965.jpg

Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong, but that shot has always looked to me more like a big multi vortex wedge, than two distinct tornadoes under the same mesocyclone or tornado cyclone. The shot is extremely impressive, but it seams to me that this was a fleeting glimpse of a very dynamic tornado, that could have filled into one solid wedge moments later or broken into even more sub vortices. I've seen similar videos of wedges where it briefly looks like multiple tornadoes, but you can see they are all part of one large tornado and the condensation funnel usually fills in later. I'm not saying "double tornadoes" don't happen as there are dozens of different configurations of tornadoes, but that Palm Sunday tornado looks to me like one large wedge.

 

[Andrew Butler]

Not sure if this is what you're looking for but it's the first thing that came to mind:


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[Danny Neal]

http://www.noaanews.noaa.gov/stories2005/images/tornado-palmsunday04-11-1965.jpg

Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong, but that shot has always looked to me more like a big multi vortex wedge, than two distinct tornadoes under the same mesocyclone or tornado cyclone. The shot is extremely impressive, but it seams to me that this was a fleeting glimpse of a very dynamic tornado, that could have filled into one solid wedge moments later or broken into even more sub vortices. I've seen similar videos of wedges where it briefly looks like multiple tornadoes, but you can see they are all part of one large tornado and the condensation funnel usually fills in later. I'm not saying "double tornadoes" don't happen as there are dozens of different configurations of tornadoes, but that Palm Sunday tornado looks to me like one large wedge.

I read this somewhere as well. I was going to post this a few hours ago but couldn't find the scientific/visual evidence to dispute it. I believe it was in a book I have on the event. Their rationalization was, as you said, that it was a monster wedge that at fleeting moments broke into a dramatic multi vortex looking dual "double" tornado appearance.

 

[Rob Strunk]

http://www.noaanews.noaa.gov/stories2005/images/tornado-palmsunday04-11-1965.jpg

Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong, but that shot has always looked to me more like a big multi vortex wedge, than two distinct tornadoes under the same mesocyclone or tornado cyclone. The shot is extremely impressive, but it seams to me that this was a fleeting glimpse of a very dynamic tornado, that could have filled into one solid wedge moments later or broken into even more sub vortices. I've seen similar videos of wedges where it briefly looks like multiple tornadoes, but you can see they are all part of one large tornado and the condensation funnel usually fills in later. I'm not saying "double tornadoes" don't happen as there are dozens of different configurations of tornadoes, but that Palm Sunday tornado looks to me like one large wedge.

You know, I never really thought about that, but it does make sense. Maybe you're right. That could have been a snapshot of what that tornado looked like for just a short time. I don't know. I just know that every time I look at that picture, it looks frightening. That was my question though, I guess. Is there any such tornadoes that would be two wedges, right next to each other like that.

Andrew Butler - Thanks for that video. That wasn't exactly what I was talking about, but that was very neat to watch. You could see as soon as the two tornadoes in that video "merged" the one dissipated. In the Elkhart Indiana picture, it "looks" like two wedge tornadoes co-existing and running side by side.

Also, the picture that was posted about the Toledo twin tornadoes was new to me as well. Very neat. That is basically what I'm looking for. That appears to be two different tornadoes co-existing side by side as well.

 

[Wesley Luginbyhl]

I was extremely lucky on May 5 2007 while cutting across the countryside to see this double tornado. It was right on the border of Kiowa, Pratt, and Edwards county. It started with the single tornado, then the smaller needle touched behind the larger funnel and rotated around the meso to be side by side. It quickly moved into the rain, but was definitely the tornado of the day for me.

Video below is of the tornado. It is very shaky as I had others in my car running the camera for me this day.

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[Chris Carter]

I read this somewhere as well. I was going to post this a few hours ago but couldn't find the scientific/visual evidence to dispute it. I believe it was in a book I have on the event. Their rationalization was, as you said, that it was a monster wedge that at fleeting moments broke into a dramatic multi vortex looking dual "double" tornado appearance.

Here is a thought that came to mind. If these two tornadoes were apart of larger wedge that was rotating, wouldn't they be rotating around each other, pretty much in sync with the wedge rotation itself?

That to me is the distinguishing factor between two tornadoes and a multi vortex tornado. In my experience of chasing and seeing photography from other people, a multi-vortex tornado is a large tornado with several smaller satellite tornadoes that rotate around it.

Didn't the Greensburg tornado have 3 tornadoes at once? The main wedge and the two smaller ones that were stationary (cyclonic and anticyclonic)?

 

[Lou Ruh]

One event that I was lucky enough to see was the Stratford, TX storm on May 15, 2003 . This was talked about in this thread ... http://www.stormtrack.org/forum/showthread.php?t=20746 . There are a lot of pictures/videos around of that event (some links are included in that thread) as well as some good DOW analysis.

 

[cedwards]

One event that comes to mind is May 3, 1999

Other days, I have seen two on the ground at the same time include Gainsville, TX May 24, 1994

Conway Springs, May 29, 2004
http://www.cloud9videos.com/ConwaySprings.php
Actually several times that day, there were at least 2 on the ground at one time.

Those are just times that come to mind right now.


It is not rare at all for there to be two tornadoes on the ground on the same storm.

 

[Bob Hartig]

Re the Elkhart twin-funnel, you'll find a great analysis on pages 43-46 of Theodore Fujita's Monthly Weather Review article, "Palm Sunday Tornadoes of April 11, 1965." The analysis includes the entire six-photo sequence shot by press photographer Paul Huffman, plus a graphic by Fujita depicting the evolution of the double-structure. The whole process from vortex breakdown back to a single funnel took about a minute.

Reports suggest that multiple funnels were rather common that day. I know of two locals in the Elkhart area who have insisted that "The Twins" were in fact the tornado that hit Dunlap an hour later. That's not the case; Huffman is an extremely credible eyewitness, and what few landmarks still remain in the area bear out his account. However, I think it's probable that the even larger Dunlap wedge took on some kind of multiple vortex structure that caused people to insist it was "The Twins."

ADDENDUM: I'll add, the Elkhart (actually, the Midway) twin funnels formed out of a single tornado cyclone and were separated by just a couple hundred feet. They weren't the product of separate circulations, and they weren't a big-tornado/satellite combination.

 

[Tony Laubach]

I've seen it on a few occasions...

As Charles said, multiple times on May 29, 2004..

May 23, 2008 south of Quinter, KS..

May 29, 2008 near Glen Elder... think you could make a case for this a few times...

Then last year on April 26, the handoff between tornadoes left both on the ground at the same time for a short amount of time..

A few days later on April 29 east of Plainview, TX, we had a pair on the ground for quite a while.

 

[Jason Persoff]

I think Tony's and Charles' posts above pretty much nail that. And those are terrific examples to boot.

Just to add a couple of observations too. On May 24, 2004, along the KS/NE borders, I taped simultaneous landspouts (x2) and tornados (x2). These 4 vortices occurred simultaneously with me happily hanging out in between them all. With me on that road was Eric Nguyen--it was one of the last times I got to chase with him. It was an amazing day.

I'd note that on May 29, 2004, Bill Hark and I were surrounded by anticyclonic vortices about a large tornadic mesocyclone in Jamestown, KS. These looked like simultaneous tornadoes, but were definitely well apart from the parent mesocyclone. Bill has a particularly awesome video of a couple of them on his site.

Satellite tornadoes are also common phenomena. As Tony mentions, the Quinter II tornado from 2008 had a well demarkated satellite vortex.

Last: in the front range of Colorado about the DCVZ, it is not uncommon to see multiple landspouts (nonmesocyclone tornados) simultaneously. By convention, this phenomenon is also described in waterspout families with a particularly amazing example (source not known by me) in the Adriatic Sea:

http://www.tornado-pictures.net/waterspouttornado.jpg

And separately here:

http://www.valdosta.edu/~jisoady/wea00312.jpg

 

[Lanny Dean]

Here is a thought that came to mind. If these two tornadoes were apart of larger wedge that was rotating, wouldn't they be rotating around each other, pretty much in sync with the wedge rotation itself?

My answer would be yes.

That to me is the distinguishing factor between two tornadoes and a multi vortex tornado. In my experience of chasing and seeing photography from other people, a multi-vortex tornado is a large tornado with several smaller satellite tornadoes that rotate around it.

Agian, your assumtion is correct. The original question was not regarding sat. tornadoes or even multi-vortex tornadoes.

Didn't the Greensburg tornado have 3 tornadoes at once? The main wedge and the two smaller ones that were stationary (cyclonic and anticyclonic)?

The Greensburg tornado at one time had 4 tornadoes on the ground at once, at least from my vantage point. While I believe that one of them was anticyclonic I do not believe that the other 2 or 3 that I saw at that particular moment were. Most of the smaller tornadoes were revolving around the parent circulation on the outer edge of the collar cloud cyclonicly. Much like the 5-3-99 event.

As far as the "Holy Grail" of storm chasing I have filmed it only 2 times in 20 years. Once during the May 29 2004 Harper county KS event (see link attached near 0:21 in). And then again on 3-28-07. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NtOrMcuSxY
Both of these tornadoes were from 2 different supercells that were very close to each other.

When I say "Holy Grail" I am not refering to sat tornadoes or the like. God knows we have all seen many of those, I am refering to 2 totally seperate tornadoes from different mesos/supercells coming in very close range/contact with another. If I understand his question correctly I think that is what he is asking.

 

[Rob Strunk]

Very informative. Thank you all who helped me with this question.