Do you think the Federal relief effort is being mismanaged?

[John Farley]

Originally posted by Tim Vasquez+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tim Vasquez)</div>

<!--QuoteBegin-Kevin Bowman

the people WHO NEED IT THE MOST will not get any because of all the people rushing and taking it as their own thus the sick and dying will get nothing

Very good point, but I'd say it goes on the assumption that thugs are at the receiving end. I'd say any little bit helps. I'd bet there are a lot of able-bodied people who are tending to the sick/elderly (some of them probably friends and relatives). But we do need a security force in there soon.

Tim[/b]

Good point, Tim. In fact, MSNBC had a very detailed report late this afternoon from two very upset reporters (because they saw people dying, and no assistance forthcoming) who said that the people at the Convention Center were orderly, that leadership had emerged among the crowd and that this informal leadership was making efforts to care for the elderly and sick, and maintain organization to the extent possible. If these reports were accurate, there would not seem to be much reason to think that in this particular case, the thugs were likely to take over. I am sure there were situations where this happened, but from this report, the Convention Center does not seem to have been one of them. Hence, I stand on my earlier argument that air drops could have saved lives, and it is inexcusable that, 3 days after the hurricane, we still seem incapable of doing them, even in a place with 15,000 desparately needy people.

Let me add my voice to those who have noted that none of their complaints are directed to the first responders or anyone helping out directly with the assistance. These problems lie with the politicians and planners, not with those providing assistance.

 

[John Farley]

Jay McCoy wrote:

"I dont buy the argument about people not having a means. There were buses all over the city taking people to shelters. anybody who stayed home did so by choice. They may not have been able to leave the city but they could have been at a shelter which would have madthings easier than spending time and resources going block to block and doing roof rescues."

Jay-

Thousands of them followed instructions to go to the Superdome and the Convention Center and other shelters, and there is still difficulty getting them out of the city, or even giving them the water they need in order to survive. Others were stranded in hotels, and were told they were to stay there. There are tens of thousands of people who went to shelters and still have had great problems being evacuated. Also, some - I admit far from all, but still a non-trivial number - were unable to leave their homes for shelters due to medical conditions or need to care for people with medical conditions. It is so easy to sit in air-conditioned comfort somewhere far from the disaster and talk about what the victims should have done. I have limited sympathy for those who ignored the warnings and simply rode out the storm because they did not want to evacuate, but many of those who now need rescue either were unable to evacuate, did go to the shelters because that was their only option, or remained in hotels per the instructions they were given.

 

[Jeff Lawson]

As far as I'm concerned, anything that happened prior to the storm is a moot issue for the time being. The fact of the matter is, you have thousands of people trapped in New Orleans - some voluntarily, some involuntarily - and something has to be done to help them. Blaming the victims for the situation accomplishes nothing. Not only that: it's disgraceful. Many had no choice but to ride the storm out in the city. And, of course, those who took shelter in the Superdome did so at the city's behest.

The federal government, meanwhile, is sitting on its ass. The President is completely detached (I guess he's still looking through his vacation photos). The FEMA director is out of his league. State and local governments are trying to do what they can, but they simply don't have the resources to manage a disaster of this magnitude. Days later, and there doesn't seem to be any sort of organized federal response. Hell, there doesn't even seem to be a plan.

 

[Jay McCoy]

I know of the people in the superdome and other shelters and the conditions there. One of the problems is rescuers are having to waste resources that could be used there on rooftop rescues and trying to keep the peace. Thats why I said shoot the looters in their tracks. That would stop alot of the anarchy and let emergency personel do their job. As for not being able to at least go to a shelter.. Bull... they had public transportation all over the city to the shelters but people CHOSE to ride it out at home. I didnt say they could have left the city but they could have been in a shelter in a centralized location.

As for sitting in air conditioning away from the situation. I am a member of the Amarillo Emergency Service and we have already been put on notice so if we are needed we can deploy so I will probably be in the middle of the relief effort which is what I have given 100's of hours of training to do so dont think for a moment that I am one of those that dont back their words with actions. Anybody who has been invloved with a disaster knows the logistics involved in even a small one. This is mammoth and everything cant happen and be in place in 2 or 3 days. We dont have transporters like in Star Trek where we can magically move people and material from other states. even after you activate a guard unit it takes time for them to check, pack, and move their gear. same with everything else. The government started the ball rolling the day before it hit but you cant bring the stuff in before the storm. watch the next 2 days and see how fast things ramp up.

 

[Benjamin Sipprell]

Originally posted by Jay McCoy
I know of the people in the superdome and other shelters and the conditions there. One of the problems is rescuers are having to waste resources that could be used there on rooftop rescues and trying to keep the peace. Thats why I said shoot the looters in their tracks. That would stop alot of the anarchy and let emergency personel do their job. As for not being able to at least go to a shelter.. Bull... they had public transportation all over the city to the shelters but people CHOSE to ride it out at home. I didnt say they could have left the city but they could have been in a shelter in a centralized location.

True that ... and I can understand people crying in pain, frustration, etc., but hey they have to remember that they put themselves in that situation ... it would have been nice when the mayor saw that it was a cat 5 and a day away to order up some buses like we are seeing now and put others in the superdome ... but eh ... oh well

I just wish vilgilanties would rise to stop the few that are causing the problems ... snipering, looting, raping ... terrorizing ... there are more in need who should be frustrated not at those who help but those who are inflicting chaos.

 

[Anonymous]

Originally posted by Benjamin Sipprell+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Benjamin Sipprell)</div>

<!--QuoteBegin-Jay McCoy

I know of the people in the superdome and other shelters and the conditions there. One of the problems is rescuers are having to waste resources that could be used there on rooftop rescues and trying to keep the peace. Thats why I said shoot the looters in their tracks. That would stop alot of the anarchy and let emergency personel do their job. As for not being able to at least go to a shelter.. Bull... they had public transportation all over the city to the shelters but people CHOSE to ride it out at home. I didnt say they could have left the city but they could have been in a shelter in a centralized location.

True that ... and I can understand people crying in pain, frustration, etc., but hey they have to remember that they put themselves in that situation ... it would have been nice when the mayor saw that it was a cat 5 and a day away to order up some buses like we are seeing now and put others in the superdome ... but eh ... oh well

I just wish vilgilanties would rise to stop the few that are causing the problems ... snipering, looting, raping ... terrorizing ... there are more in need who should be frustrated not at those who help but those who are inflicting chaos.[/b]

I agree with that but what about the people that were physically unable to leave their homes? New Orleans mayor and city officials knew that there are people living alone with no help. What about them? As soon as Katrina grew to a cat. 3 more should of been done, Louisiana's govenor should be held accountable for how the evacuation was handled.

Now it doesn't matter where the people are, if they should or shouldn't be there (Convention Center) we/FEMA/Mr. Bush KNOW they are there, get SOMEONE/SOMETHING there to help these people.

 

[rdale]

"The President is completely detached (I guess he's still looking through his vacation photos)."

Why does this keep coming up? What has he NOT done that he was asked to do? Remember - the President is not an EM expert. That's why FEMA & DHS exist. If they need the President to do something, they go to him and say "sign this" and he does. The President does not allocate NG resources, or request Motorola send down 3000 radios, or Walmart donate water bottles. That's all done by the local / state / national Emergency Management groups. Not the President.

My guess is that if Gore was running the show, he'd be doing the exact same thing and you'd be telling us what a great job the recovery has been. That sort of talk has no place in a disaster.

 

[rdale]

"As soon as Katrina grew to a cat. 3 more should of been done, Louisiana's govenor should be held accountable for how the evacuation was handled."

The Governor cannot order a CITY to be evacuated. Come on people, simple basics. The MAYOR screwed up by rejected earlier calls to evacuate. Doesn't matter what the Governer or FEMA or DHS or anyone else wants - if the mayor doesn't order an evac, one does NOT occur.

 

[Chris Hayes]

Emergency management begins at the local level. Once a screwup (evacuating too late) occurs at the local level, it takes longer for the state and federal emergency managers to get the situation is under control. Let's not forget LA, AL, MS, GA, and FL have been hit by this. It's a lot bigger than 9-11, and even Andrew was.

 

[Sean McMullen]

The day before Katrina hit my fiance's father was sent down to New Orleans. His name is Steven Lade and he's a manager for the power company (OPPD Omaha Public Power District) up here in Nebraska. They sent him down there with a crew of 30 men to help restore power after the storm. It became very clear that no one planned well for this event. When they arrived they had no hotel for them, no food for them, and no idea of where they were going to work or how they would work. He just called yesterday to tell us they got two hotel rooms, thats 14 sweaty nasty men a room each, and they still have no idea what they're doing down there. In a sense they have become victims themselves.

This just in, while I was writing this post we just received word that they no longer have a hotel because they had to give them up to the victims of New Orleans, they also said that they've had people begging them for help, and they are starting to become really scared of people robbing them or attacking them.

I'm really getting worried for them, it seems like they just sent them down there with no plan or backup plan, and watching the news it seems to be consistent with everything else thats happening down there.

 

[Anonymous]

Originally posted by Sean McMullen
The day before Katrina hit my fiance's father was sent down to New Orleans. His name is Steven Lade and he's a manager for the power company (OPPD Omaha Public Power District) up here in Nebraska. They sent him down there with a crew of 30 men to help restore power after the storm. It became very clear that no one planned well for this event. When they arrived they had no hotel for them, no food for them, and no idea of where they were going to work or how they would work. He just called yesterday to tell us they got two hotel rooms, thats 14 sweaty nasty men a room each, and they still have no idea what they're doing down there. In a sense they have become victims themselves.

This just in, while I was writing this post we just received word that they no longer have a hotel because they had to give them up to the victims of New Orleans, they also said that they've had people begging them for help, and they are starting to become really scared of people robbing them or attacking them.

I'm really getting worried for them, it seems like they just sent them down there with no plan or backup plan, and watching the news it seems to be consistent with everything else thats happening down there.

That is scary.......hope they stay safe.

 

[Anonymous]

Bill O'Reilly is right on the money.....he's eating into a Lt. with the National Guard about not being "ON THE BALL". So true, so true.

 

[Anonymous]

Originally posted by rdale
\"The President is completely detached (I guess he's still looking through his vacation photos).\"

Why does this keep coming up? What has he NOT done that he was asked to do? Remember - the President is not an EM expert. That's why FEMA & DHS exist. If they need the President to do something, they go to him and say \"sign this\" and he does. The President does not allocate NG resources, or request Motorola send down 3000 radios, or Walmart donate water bottles. That's all done by the local / state / national Emergency Management groups. Not the President.

My guess is that if Gore was running the show, he'd be doing the exact same thing and you'd be telling us what a great job the recovery has been. That sort of talk has no place in a disaster.

whats funny is most people think he dosent work on his vacations, id love to see everyone here go on vacation and still have to do everyday things like run a country. God forbid Washington DC is destroyed and they have to run the country from another location

 

[Amos Magliocco]

This is the greatest failure and collapse of American government since maybe the Civil War. That there are still, tonight, no troops at the convention center, and that no controlling force seems to be in charge of either New Orleans or the relief effort in general is a derelection of duty on a Biblical scale. When this is over, it will be time to examine everything about the people in Washington D.C..

 

[B Doss]

Originally posted by Amos Magliocco
When this is over, it will be time to examine everything about the people in Washington D.C..

Long overdue.

Sidney Blumenthal:

"In 2001, FEMA warned that a hurricane striking New Orleans was one of the three most likely disasters in the U.S. But the Bush administration cut New Orleans flood control funding by 44 percent to pay for the Iraq war."