Copyright Infringement Reports (Review guidelines in post #1 before posting here)

[Robert Dewey]

I'd caution that some of the statements being made could be considered libelous if these images were legally purchased through said service. If that stock photo company does not have the legal right to sell the photos in question (i.e. Lanny didn't post them there nor give that stock photo company permission to sell his photos), then it would be the stock company's fault.

Not to complicate it further, but the stock photo company could also be covered under the "safe harbor" rules of the DMCA (if their user agreement places all liability onto the offender), in which case the only party responsible is the one who uploaded Lanny's image(s) to the service.

Also, it's up to the infringed party (not the offender) to take action to protect their copyright, which can include filing a DMCA complaint.

 

[MatthewCarman]

Jeremy if you did legally use and pay for those photographs and this becomes a legal matter you may want to look into "false accusations and the law".

 

[Clarence Bennett]

Personally, I am amazed that such a big deal was made out of this. I read the document, saw where he gave credit at the end of the document, and quite honestly, it is very apparent that Jeremy did enough due diligence to cover himself. On top of that, he has not tried to sell this guide.

I am on the other side of the fence from most of you that post on here regularly. I will just say that. Very few of you know anything about me, what my background is, what I do for a living, etc. I am amazed at how loosely the "legal threats" are tossed around on this board. I do not depend on a photo to make a living, so I can understand some of the frustration; however, you must put it all in perspective when threatening legal to someone and stating that they are going to owe you X amount of money.

This fellow put quite a bit of time into his project that could really help to educate the public whether it be through this forum, via his local school system, etc. Something that could be used as a great education tool for local spotters, the public, school systems etc. has now been thrown away due to what I call pure and simple greed.

It sickens me that some of you hide behind the curtain that you are "saving lives" and doing some service for the community, when in reality, all you are trying to do is make a quick buck and clogging up the highway.

In the end, I suggest being very cautious threatening legal against someone else. One of these days, you may run across the wrong person that has more "legal" experience than you realize and in the end, it may cost you far more than you expect to make off of a picture.

 

[Jeremy Den Hartog]

Jeremy if you did legally use and pay for those photographs and this becomes a legal matter you may want to look into "false accusations and the law".

I hear you but at this point all I really want is this to be resolved so I can hopefully re-share this free guide (after all, I did put a fair amount of effort into it). The last thing I want is this to be 'hanging over my head' during the holiday season...

 

[MatthewCarman]

I understand Jeremy and I hope it gets resolved "Peacefully".

I hate it when people drop a big turd like this. People need better communication skills. Seriously this thing could have been handled alot differently with the same results.

 

[Robert Dewey]

Personally, I am amazed that such a big deal was made out of this. I read the document, saw where he gave credit at the end of the document, and quite honestly, it is very apparent that Jeremy did enough due diligence to cover himself. On top of that, he has not tried to sell this guide.

I am on the other side of the fence from most of you that post on here regularly. I will just say that. Very few of you know anything about me, what my background is, what I do for a living, etc. I am amazed at how loosely the "legal threats" are tossed around on this board. I do not depend on a photo to make a living, so I can understand some of the frustration; however, you must put it all in perspective when threatening legal to someone and stating that they are going to owe you X amount of money.

This fellow put quite a bit of time into his project that could really help to educate the public whether it be through this forum, via his local school system, etc. Something that could be used as a great education tool for local spotters, the public, school systems etc. has now been thrown away due to what I call pure and simple greed.

It sickens me that some of you hide behind the curtain that you are "saving lives" and doing some service for the community, when in reality, all you are trying to due is make a quick buck and clogging up the highway.

In the end, I suggest being very cautious threatening legal against someone else. One of these days, you may run across the wrong person that has more "legal" experience than you realize and in the end, it may cost you far more than you expect to make off of a picture.

Agreed - I'm still not seeing where a great financial harm was done to any of the "offended" parties. In fact, I think any legal action would cost far more than what you'd get in return. I also think a more civil (and legally safe) way to handle this would have been through PMs vs. outright libelous accusations of theft.

I do not make a living from chasing or photography - those are more of a fun spare time activity to me - but I can understand the feeling of someone "infringing" on work that may potentially put food on the table (it happens in all industries).

 

[Chris C Sanner]

Agreed - I'm still not seeing where a great financial harm was done to any of the "offended" parties. In fact, I think any legal action would cost far more than what you'd get in return. I also think a more civil (and legally safe) way to handle this would have been through PMs vs. outright libelous accusations of theft.

I do not make a living from chasing or photography - those are more of a fun spare time activity to me - but I can understand the feeling of someone "infringing" on work that may potentially put food on the table (it happens in all industries).

I concur. It'd be tough to get any serious amount of money off of an education presentation posted on a message board. The legal costs of such a suit wouldn't exactly be cheap. It'd be very unfortunate too, because Jeremy is doing everything he can it appears to resolve this.

If Jeremy legally bought the pictures and is using them within his rights (which if he only used BigStockPhoto and Wikipedia then he most likely is) then Lanny might have a beef with the companies he posted the pictures on. It's also possible someone bought Lanny's pictures off a better Stock Photo site and then uploaded them to BSP and thus Jeremy downloaded them from there. You can't just come out in public and start making libelous accusations without getting full proof as to exactly what happened, that's poor communication and for someone trying to make a living off storm chasing, really bad PR skills.

Now with that said, if Jeremy did somehow steal the photos without a watermark from a stock site and used them in his presentation, then of course there is a huge problem. Either way, this was most likely some form of honest mistake which could have been held out of the public eye so as to avoid damaging the reputations of either party. Lanny has ran a great business the past several years and is entitled to full protection of his material, but I just wish all the facts would have been gathered before making such rash judgments. Hopefully this is just some form of an honest mistake so both parties can get a positive ending to this.

I hope both of you can get this resolved ASAP so you both can have a Merry Christmas...and so we can start worrying about Tornadoes again soon enough.

 

[Jeremy Den Hartog]

I concur. It'd be tough to get any serious amount of money off of an education presentation posted on a message board. The legal costs of such a suit wouldn't exactly be cheap. It'd be very unfortunate too, because Jeremy is doing everything he can it appears to resolve this.

If Jeremy legally bought the pictures and is using them within his rights (which if he only used BigStockPhoto and Wikipedia then he most likely is) then Lanny might have a beef with the companies he posted the pictures on. It's also possible someone bought Lanny's pictures off a better Stock Photo site and then uploaded them to BSP and thus Jeremy downloaded them from there. You can't just come out in public and start making libelous accusations without getting full proof as to exactly what happened, that's poor communication and for someone trying to make a living off storm chasing, really bad PR skills.

Now with that said, if Jeremy did somehow steal the photos without a watermark from a stock site and used them in his presentation, then of course there is a huge problem. Either way, this was most likely some form of honest mistake which could have been held out of the public eye so as to avoid damaging the reputations of either party. Lanny has ran a great business the past several years and is entitled to full protection of his material, but I just wish all the facts would have been gathered before making such rash judgments. Hopefully this is just some form of an honest mistake both parties can get a positive ending to this.

I hope both of you can get this resolved ASAP so you both can have a Merry Christmas...and so we can start worrying about Tornadoes again soon enough.

I agree that this could have been handled better. That being said, I have nothing against Lanny. He may or may not like me (it really doesn't matter either way) but I fully respect who he is and what he does as far as storm chasing goes.

 

[Chris C Sanner]

I agree that this could have been handled better. That being said, I have nothing against Lanny. He may or may not like me (it really doesn't matter either way) but I fully respect who he is and what he does as far as storm chasing goes.

Definitely! Lanny by all accounts, is a pretty good guy and without a doubt a great chaser. Just some people let their emotions get the best of them and act before thinking. Nothing wrong with having huge passion for what you do, but it's never a good idea to start throwing around accusations before all the facts are in. I understand fully where Lanny is coming from, it's a terrible feeling, but you have to do a bit of background research into the matter and try to gather the facts before coming out and accusing someone of doing something illegal...because if your first hunch is wrong, then you end up looking pretty bad.

Either way, hope you and Lanny get this resolved quickly...no reason this can't easily be resolved in five minutes if both parties simply communicate

 

[Scott Weberpal]

Jeremy - could you post links to the wikipedia entries where you got the photos? I'd like to see what other pictures are on there as well.

Also, if you'd like to use any of my photos to replace any of the "offending" images (if there even are any) just let me know and you can use them as long as you give credit. It was a great guide and I'd hate to see it gone because of a little tussle.

 

[Jim Saueressig]

I can't say that I remember seeing the guide myself so I am not sure of which pictures are in dispute but it is my understanding that they are not the ones you posted back in the thread nor are they even from that site. The ones you posted are not even from the same person by the looks of your screen shots nor do they resemble Lanny's name.

That being said I would also be interested in where on wiki you got the photos per a link as Scott has also requested.

 

[Jeremy Den Hartog]

I'll see what I can do guys but to be honest I may have some difficulty tracking down the exact locations since its been a few years since I put the book together. I will be up in Minneapolis most of the day though (Im accessing the site with my cellphone) so won't have a chance to do any digging today...

Thank you very much for the offers about the images

 

[Eric Whitehill]

Why don't you just use your own photos, instead of others? That would then make this entire discussion mute.

 

[Jeremy Den Hartog]

Why don't you just use your own photos, instead of others? That would then make this entire discussion mute.

Because in all honesty I didn't take a bunch of pictures up until the last few years and the ones I did take were not very good quality

 

[Robert Dewey]

Why don't you just use your own photos, instead of others? That would then make this entire discussion mute.

Exactly. I mean, why don't stock photo companies only sell photos they take? Or why don't Wikipedia only display photos taken by the founders? It makes perfect sense...