Changes to Target Area

[Tim Vasquez]

We're planning on making a change to Target Area to simplify the threads and Target Area concept, and simplify the rules too. The moderators and some users have voiced concern about the Target Area format becoming kind of complicated and causing some management and TOS trouble. Also the [REPORTS] format is not conducive to post-storm discussion since the thread is limited to firsthand accounts. I think the proposals sound reasonable and for 2009 we expect to go from 4 to either 2 or 1 category per target/date.

Please vote on which way you prefer that we go with this. You may also reply with comments.

On one hand, we can separate the discussion into a [FCST] thread for all PRE-thunderstorm discussion, then once storms have started, a [SUMM] category handles all storm nowcasts, reports, chase summaries, and post-chase discussion.

On the other hand, we can have all discussion in one thread, so we'd have threads called simply "4/17/09 TX Panhandle". It might seem that the thread would have information overload, but all the threads will generally follow a chronological progression, thus we'd be likely to find the forecasts at the start of the thread, nowcasts midway, and summaries and Monday morning quarterbacking towards the end.

We will not necessarily abide by the results but they'll be used to gauge user opinion on the issue.

If you don't use Target Area regularly we ask that you refrain from voting. Thanks,

Tim

 

[Jason Foster]

While I appreciate the needs of the moderates to make the Target area manageable for them to administer, however I personally like the current format. It seems to me that handling too much data in one thread (or two only) can become overwhelming, and during heavy use may put a toll on the thread loads and such. I suspect the Admin. and Mod. have considered that, however I wanted to mention it, if it had not.

I also wonder about duplicate message that may be posted because of the rapid message rate rather than the current system.

If there were a poll choice for "no change" I would select that.

Add:
If it is simply a matter of man power, that perhaps more managers would be a better solution. But again, likely discussed prior to this Poll.

 

[Jeff Snyder]

I still fully support the current 4-type Target Area scheme - FCST, NOW, REPORTS, DISC, though I am, admittently, a bit biased given my role in helping to create the current system. I don't think it's terribly difficult to understand:

FCST - Discussion of event prior to event initiation
NOW - Event has started (e.g. nowcasts, etc)
REPORTS - Post-storm chaser reports
DISC - Discussion of event after event ended

The above seems relatively uncomplicated, though there certainly are "for examples" that may be difficult to classify.

That said, if the moderators are intent on changing the Target Area, then I opt for choice #1 - maintaining a FCST thread, but merging everything else. Having a "single thread per event" rule would make for tremendously long threads that would be a big hodgepodge of stuff. Let's say there's a typical, anticipated May event that garners 35-40 pages of posts between the forecasts, nowcasts, reports, and discussion. I want to check out what other chasers saw that day, so I start looking for the reports. Ugh - what page do the reports start on? Page 30? Page 34? I don't know, so I start clicking away. But wait, I read one report, then 4-5 "DISC"-type discussion posts. Oy, I end up having to browse through 6-10 pages of posts just to read the chase reports.

Could you consider merging just the DISC-NOW thread types? So, there could be FCST, DISC, and REPORTS... This would maintain an easy-to-find thread for first-hand chase reports that, I think, so many of fellow Stormtrackers find informative and interesting. Just my 2 cents, of course.

 

[Shane Adams]

If a choice between 1-2 threads per date is the question, I'd prefer 2:

(1) A single thread for REPORTS from CHASERS
(2) All the other armchair/fantasy/"I nailed the target but I couldn't chase because..." stuff in the other.

Chaser reports are the only thing I am concerned with regarding TA.

 

[Jim Saueressig]

Could you consider merging just the DISC-NOW thread types? So, there could be FCST, DISC, and REPORTS... This would maintain an easy-to-find thread for first-hand chase reports that, I think, so many of fellow Stormtrackers find informative and interesting. Just my 2 cents, of course.

Anything mixed with a Now thread would be a nightmare IMO. I could see Reports and Discussion merged into one because discussing the reports would seem okay but I think Now and Forecasts need their own thread.

 

[John Wetter]

I'd be most in favor of a three-type approach:

FCST - 60 hours to Initiation
NOW - In-event (for chasers, nowcasters, and observers)
DISC - Reports and event related discussion.

 

[Connor McCrorey]

I'd be most in favor of a three-type approach:

FCST - 60 hours to Initiation
NOW - In-event (for chasers, nowcasters, and observers)
DISC - Reports and event related discussion.

Honestly I like the current system, but if it must change I would support this sort of setup.

 

[Adam Lucio]

I like the current system too. But if it had to change I think merging the DISC and reports thread would be a good way to go. Since its all talk about the same event once its happened.

I agree with Jim though, anything mixed with a NOW thread would get crazy, Ive seen NOW threads go over 10 pages and I know I wouldnt want to sift through all that for reports and whatnot.

 

[Skip Talbot]

I think it would be a shame to change the current system. Jeff nailed the mains points. I definitely think that if we can't keep the current system, we should have a three thread setup with forecasts, discussion, and reports. Even with two threads per event deal we are still going to be sifting through lots of frivolous posts when trying to get the actual chase reports.

 

[Ryan McGinnis]

I agree -- the current system seems to work fine. This may be because of a lot of behind-the-scenes moderation, but as it is, you have four distinct categories for four very distinct needs. If any of the categories need to be smashed together, I'd reccomend smashing FCST and NOW -- seeing as forecasts naturally taper off as events unfurl and seeing as it can sometimes be difficult to decide when FCST should be shut off and moved to NOW. But merging them all together seems like a bad idea -- the forum will be much more chaotic, anyhow.

 

[Chris Nuttall]

First off, nothing has to change. This is just a proposal. Just so everyone knows, this idea for change originated with me. I have two concerns that keep bugging me with the current system. The REPORTS thread does not really allow for a smooth flow of discussion regarding chasers' reports. To me, it feels stupid handing out warnings/infractions to people that post questions/comments regarding a report in a REPORTS thread. Yes, it could go in a PM or in DISC, but like I said, I think it hurts the flow of ideas, and I'm kind of anal when it comes to continuity.

It is not so much a question of workload management. There has been some concern raised over so much moderation of the TA taking place versus other problems that have arisen on the board, and how there doesn't seem to be a balance between the two. This is an idea that I had come up with (and was also proposed by a user to me separately) to help mitigate those problems.

Another option would be to keep the current system in place, then combine the REPORTS and DISC, say...7 days after the event. I appreciate that several people prefer to have a separate, quick-reference, reports-only thread, and I certainly see the value in the current system. As a moderator, I'm always looking at how our forum operates and if there are ways that we could change it to make it better.

Remember, this change may or may not happen, even if the majority of voters approve. This is an idea that I put forth, the moderators talked about, the decided to see what our the rest of the ST community thought.

There will probably be more discussion behind the scenes after this poll closes. If you want to see changes in the TA, but don't like our options, use this thread to propose your own. Depending on what comes out of here, we may have another round or two of voting and discussion.

 

[Ryan McGinnis]

First off, nothing has to change. This is just a proposal. Just so everyone knows, this idea for change originated with me. I have two concerns that keep bugging me with the current system. The REPORTS thread does not really allow for a smooth flow of discussion regarding chasers' reports. To me, it feels stupid handing out warnings/infractions to people that post questions/comments regarding a report in a REPORTS thread. Yes, it could go in a PM or in DISC, but like I said, I think it hurts the flow of ideas, and I'm kind of anal when it comes to continuity.

Is there any reason you guys can't just lift the restriction of commentary or questions about reports in the REPORTS threads? In my eyes the only two threads where people generally need to keep chatter to an absoloute minimum are the FCST and NOW threads, which are sometimes operationally used in the field by actual chasers. I don't know about other users, but I could care less if I have to swim through a few extra posts in the reports thread. On chase days, by the time I'm reading a REPORTS thread, it's either the next day or on the long ride home.

 

[Danny Neal]

IMO lock the forecast thread after a certain point (say after initiation). Then lock the NOW thread after the event has ended and combine the DISC and Report threads. Problem solved. People post their reports and if someone has a question or a comment feel free to post it. This site is for the enthusiast now so why not just let them say what they want about the report and discuss from there.

 

[Dustin Wilcox]

Current system seems best IMO; only problem I see, is with the recent explosion of new members, it appears many forget to read the rules. Strongly enforce the rules, and I think the current system is by far the best option.

 

[Jim Saueressig]

If you really wanted two threads rather than the four like it is now I would have to say a Forecast/Now thread since Now would take over for the Forecast as initiation started and a Discussion/Reports thread. I always thought it odd that Discussion and Reports were separate anyways.