Re-used tornado video from 6/12/04

  • Thread starter Thread starter Dan Robinson
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I'm surprised by the lack of response from Andy Fabel since he is a ST member with his last login being yesterday, I'm sure he's aware that this thread exist. If his video was legit like he claimed it to be then you would think that he would be on here defending himself and offering up proof that his video is legit.
 
He took the route that would make him look the best to the most, surely not the ones that will matter most, since those "most" will forget who he was tomorrow. Fact is, I'm betting a big chunk out of the chasing circles buy his excuse 100%. If the media would do a better job, they'd come back and SHOW perfectly well how it was a lie. Otherwise, most are going to buy the chaser jealously deal...and Dan will look the worst out of the whole thing. I'd be more than a little pissed about it if I was Dan and did ask to not have his name mentioned like he said he did.

But something tells me they won't do a better job at showing full well how it was the Rock KS tornado. If they did, they'd probably do as well as Fox "news" did...which was a joke. I'm always amazed how how simple something can be, and how hard the news makes it.

I can sorta see where H is coming from here. It's like he chose to try and look the best to the world instead of the chasing world, because the latter is such a small minority. The only problem with this approach is, if he can't convince the media he's innocent (which he isn't), he's lost on both sides. The chasing world knows he's guilty, the media thinks he is, and the rest of the world already doesn't care. Seems like a lose/lose to me. The worst part is, the bit of integrity he would've had to keep himself company at night isn't even there anymore.
 
A friend at CNN just sent me this story.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/technology/chi-fri-tornado-fake-videos-jul11,0,7341604.story

There is your before and after photos that everyone is asking for in the news story.

And to touch on the subject of short memory stuff, the public might have a short memory but the news media does not. His last name is now the new industry code word for fake footage from what I was told.

As for chasers having a short memory, yeah right, I could name several events that will start flame wars by just saying one short word for each event.
 
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I can sorta see where H is coming from here. It's like he chose to try and look the best to the world instead of the chasing world, because the latter is such a small minority. The only problem with this approach is, if he can't convince the media he's innocent (which he isn't), he's lost on both sides. The chasing world knows he's guilty, the media thinks he is, and the rest of the world already doesn't care. Seems like a lose/lose to me. The worst part is, the bit of integrity he would've had to keep himself company at night isn't even there anymore.

Yeah, but the story is generally going to die after the main AP thing yesterday. I just bet a larger portion of readers buy into his jealously excuse, and since they never showed the "pudding" in the article itself, they don't have much of a reason not to. And sure maybe it's not a majority, but it would be some that wouldn't think he's a liar/faker....as opposed to if he confessed.
 
Mr. Fabel could clear this up very fast if he would just show us his 2004 Rock, KS tornado footage. Oh, wait we have already seen it.

From what many people in the general public are saying is seems that they aren't convinced that the Valentine, NE tornado is faked. They don't seem to understand that a tornado will look slightly different from different angles and have different objects in the foreground.
 
Well, according to Martin Lisius on wx-chase, the WCM in LBF is removing the tornado report from Valentine, Nebraska on July 5th. According to Martin:

Based on her data, there was apparently just a funnel cloud and no tornado.

EDIT - Here is the funnel in question (taken from LBF's website). Mr. Fabel's angle was remarkably different.
 
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f it look like a duck ,speaks like a duck yada yada its (your ) duck-video plagiarism

If it look like a duck ,speaks like a duck yada yada its (your ) duck. Well not exactly

Now such plagiaristic video is making the rounds.

Those two funnel tornadoes do like quite similar but the questions are
(1) was there severe weather that day in Kansas in that area ? (seems no)

(2) why would this guy take the time to capture and show this particular tornado and send this to the new service when it is not that all spectacular (I feel like the news service was really hard up for some more photos?).

(3) As we have seen there are many that have tried to steal many videos and photos and pawn it off as their own (as we have seen on copyright infringments many have copied Mike H. great stuff).

It could be that a tornado or another object is caught videotaped or photographed from a different direction at the same time. That is why there is a strict code of astronomical "law" relating to how, when and who gets a comet named after them. Sometimes it is not who gets the word out first but when the object is identified and verified by Harvard University first!

I took a photos of the great Comet McNaught on January 10, 2007. The last one was my best (it is on my eoas blog). I had coordinated with a guy, a then so called astronomy friend I had met, and we caught the comet for 4 days. I posted my pic on my blog. He sent me an email and said it was his picture and that I had stolen it. I was flabbergasted. I had a hard time with this as I was standing right next to him with my camera. I informed the club president about this and did not want any more harrassment. I am glad that he resigned a position from my club because of this or for whatever reason.

I have been telling students and warning about not copying to websites, their projects , activities, blogs, work, photos for years.

A few years ago in nearby Piper, Kansas, a number of students (I was teaching there at the time but was not the science teacher) biology class students copied a lot of internet stuff for their science projects. When their misdeeds were found out out nothing was done to the students but the teacher quit because of the fire storm. This made headlines all over the nation.

Even in my EOAS camp for junior high kids which started last week , I preach to the students that they need to show their sources for photos and links for their blogs, powerpoints and websites.

The video was retracted. Now what?
 
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The Gold medal in this multi-page thread goes to Dan's video imitating the changes Fabel made to his. Kudos to Dan for catching the fraud. Silver and Bronze medals to Mike Peregrine.

Silver: http://www.stormtrack.org/forum/showpost.php?p=186392&postcount=114 (link to the picture of the ACTUAL Valentine, NE funnel of 7/5/2008)/. The sound you just heard was the last nail being pounded into the coffin.

Bronze: http://www.stormtrack.org/forum/showpost.php?p=186197&postcount=45 (for understanding marketing in the Age of the Internet)

Honorable mention: His link to the sportshooter article: http://www.stormtrack.org/forum/showpost.php?p=186191&postcount=42

Yeah, its sad/sensational to see a guy go down in flames fueled by pride while carrying an empty fire extinguisher of ethics but there are also valuable lessons to be learned from this Greek Tragedy. Mike pointed out more than his share in this thread.
 
I'm not quite sure what the spirit of your post is here. Are you aiming this at the fellow in question in this thread, or at his detractors?

Maybe (with the different fonts and all) this is copied from somewhere. Not sure. But I'll take a stab at it anyway despite all of this and despite the fact that I'm a newb. Grain of salt, etc.

If it look like a duck ,speaks like a duck yada yada its (your ) duck. Well not exactly

Now such plagiaristic video is making the rounds.

Since this individual was present at Rock Island, and since none have spoken in claim that this is their own video, it is reasonable to assume this video is, in fact, Mr. Fable's [sic]. Although plagiarism of one's own works is technically possible if the individual has made a contract with a different publisher beforehand, there is no indication that his video of this tornado achieved such a status. Therefore, no plagiarism is actually involved here, and the fact that none have levied this on him proves this. He's lying about his own footage, not stealing from another.

Those two funnel tornadoes do like quite similar but the questions are (1) was there severe weather that day in Kansas in that area ? (seems no)

The Rock, KS footage from 2004 has been verified by many independent sources, and the burden of proof is thus on the author of this statement to discredit these sources to establish that no severe weather happened in Kansas on this day. This will likely be impossible to do.

Despite the difference in minor details, the chances that a tornado will, throughout its entire lifespan, behave in mirrored shape, form, direction, and duration in exact comparison to a previous tornado is near zero. The minor differences can be explained by the fact that his footage was shot from a slightly different vantage - likely from a slightly different angle, and zoomed in past the trees that distracted from the view (thus the power lines are prominent as a result).

I'm assuming you meant Nebraska here anyway, and not Kansas. Although a funnel was seen in the area on that day last week, no tornado was reported as far as I know.
(2) why would this guy take the time to capture and show this particular tornado and send this to the new service when it is not that all spectacular (I feel like the news service was really hard up for some more photos?).

The fact that the Rock, Kansas tornado from 2004 is "garden variety" actually tends to speak more for the idea that Mr. Fable attempted to pass off previous footage as a current event. He likely considered this tornado to be relatively average, and even though he knew others were on that storm, he probably assumed that (like him) the tornado wouldn't be important enough to stand out in the memory of the other chasers who were there.

Although I do not know about this particular date in chaser lore, I have read that at least one individual caught two others on the Rock Island chase; if chasers generally caught more and better tubes than just Rock Island's on that day, then Mr. Fable likely assumed the chances of any chaser viewing that video and recalling it would be lessened even more.

The attempt to "flip" this footage lends some credence to this idea, since even if a chaser would have recalled this in the furthest reaches of his memory, flipping it might be enough to cause doubt and make such chasers move on. IMO this is somewhat representative of the lack of knowledge on how important some chasers consider each of their catches to be, no matter how "low quality" the tube and no matter how old the storm is.

Furthermore, if he knew his tube wasn't particularly Mulvane-quality, he probably thought the media would pay him the $300 and send it to a few outlets near the obscure and barren land of Cherry County rather than spreading it everywhere. If not this, he at least figured it would remain well out of the reaches of other Midwest news outlets, who are used to "better" footage (and thus, this keeps it out of view of most chasers who may still guess his fraud). The fact that he sped it up probably indicates that he thought the footage was "too" average and risked being rejected (or, he may have still been scared that Rock, KS was submitted years before despite its "poor look"), so he doctored it up - and made it "too" exciting for the lay person, and as a result it spread much further than he likely figured it would. Backfire!

So, since he probably thought distribution wouldn't be wide or prominent due to his opinion of the lower comparative quality of the tornado from Rock KS, and since he picked a tornado he considered average from four years back on a multiple-tornado day, he submitted this "not that all spectacular" footage with the idea that he could pocket a quick buck for something he figured wouldn't be touted much and laugh uncaught all the way to the bank. Backfire!
(3) As we have seen there are many that have tried to steal many videos and photos and pawn it off as their own (as we have seen on copyright infringments many have copied Mike H. great stuff).

Once again, this was not stolen. At the very least, he used his own footage, but he deceived the press into thinking it was from a different event, which was wrong.
It could be that a tornado or another object is caught videotaped or photographed from a different direction at the same time. That is why there is a strict code of astronomical "law" relating to how, when and who gets a comet named after them. Sometimes it is not who gets the word out first but when the object is identified and verified by Harvard University first!

Again, nobody has stood up to claim this as their own footage, even though this story stuck to the front of the Yahoo news page for a long time earlier (more or less that this thread is now another novel). From my limited understanding of the chaser world, if this video was stolen, then at the very least someone else likely would have recognized the source. Still, though, if Mr. Fable was in a group and this was the sole footage of the group as a whole, then his chasing partner(s) from that day would have a legitimate grievance for the footage being used in this way.

The video was retracted. Now what?

The ramification of his deceit to the media is between Mr. Fable and the Associated Press. However, he has lashed out at chasers and defended his lie, likely because even the most careful of the multitude of laypersons are, compared with chasers, more easily fooled (see the "digital forensic detective" piece posted earlier) and thus more taken by his defense. Additionally, the recent television shows tend to give the public the impression that chasers are in fact competitive, so such a claim of "chaser jealousy" would be even easier for the public - and perhaps he figured the media itself as well - to accept at face value. Unfortunately for him, the AP rejected this explanation of his, and this person must face the wrath of the chasing community for his unnecessary slap at us.

As Shane and Mike mentioned earlier, he could have come clean, or at least lied and said he submitted the wrong footage. An "oops, I was playing around with that Rock, KS tornado at the same time and submitted that file instead" would have still garnered some "yeah rights" from the gallery, but the only lasting, harsh criticisms would have come from the usual crowd that doles out lasting, harsh criticisms. The rest of us would have snickered and likely have forgotten by next Spring, even if he came clean and said he was desperate for bill money or something. Instead, his comment provoked wrath in probably just about every chaser out there, including chasers who normally aren't easily moved to it.

IMO this won't affect the AP. They likely won't see tons of material on tornadoes again until next year or at least until next fall; their desire for "putting it out NOW" will overcome any long process they would want to adopt for verifying the footage they received. Mr. Fable did wrong in his lie but not enough to be nailed to the wall for it - it's his butthurt behavior after it backfired on him that has opened him up to all of this.
 
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The Gold medal in this multi-page thread goes to Dan's video imitating the changes Fabel made to his. Kudos to Dan for catching the fraud. Silver and Bronze medals to Mike Peregrine.

Silver: http://www.stormtrack.org/forum/showpost.php?p=186392&postcount=114 (link to the picture of the ACTUAL Valentine, NE funnel of 7/5/2008)/. The sound you just heard was the last nail being pounded into the coffin.

Bronze: http://www.stormtrack.org/forum/showpost.php?p=186197&postcount=45 (for understanding marketing in the Age of the Internet)

Honorable mention: His link to the sportshooter article: http://www.stormtrack.org/forum/showpost.php?p=186191&postcount=42

Yeah, its sad/sensational to see a guy go down in flames fueled by pride while carrying an empty fire extinguisher of ethics but there are also valuable lessons to be learned from this Greek Tragedy. Mike pointed out more than his share in this thread.

Honorable Mention for Mike H. for making me laugh uncontrollably at the drunken bird flying backwards halfway through the submitted clip. I can't stop watching it just for the lulz.
 
The Backlash Is Everywhere Now In The Media.

Well, as I feared, the networks are gun shy with video now and tornado video for the most part. Kelly Martinson got the tornado from western MN the other day and fed it in for BNVN to take care of the sales and it was rough going. All the networks now want some kind of proof that the video is real since the bogus video hit the market.

I talked to a couple people who said they won't be buying ANY tornado or chasing video in general at all from any untrusted sources or unknown chasers until they see somethinig come in from the local stations.

I think this has killed the market for a lot of people who were looking to sell video.
 
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Aren't you dancing in the streets then? Being a trusted source and all, and it going to be so hard for "others" to sell stuff. I probably would be. I wonder what all these "untrusteds" get to do to prove it. If only the chaser merit badge things existed, one could just flash one of those around. I just wonder what really will make it so much harder now, what that extra "proof" is going to really consist of. Did you have to do an online pinky swear with them to make the sale? I'm seriously wondering.
 
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