HD Video being sold for 17-22 bucks a sec!! WTF?!

[Erik Burns]

A friend of mine ( who is a very well known chaser ) calls me today and gives me news of a couple of chasers that sold HD Aurora Tornado footage from fairly close rang destroying a structure. Turns out these chasers pretty much gave the footage away to the TWC program "Storm Stories" for $17.00 and $22.00 a second. This has fired up several chasers, including myself. I for one do not make a living storm chasing. I do like to make supplemental income from my chasing to help with chasing and other expenses. Now Storm Stories has contacted my good friend and the best offer they made for his HD tornado footage is around the digits as mentioned earlier! He offered another low amount back but higher than 22 and they declined his offer saying it was too steep.

So is your HD close up tornado video worth more to you than 17-22 bucks a second? People need to stop giving stuff away for free. Yes there will always be the guys who does something ignorant just to get his name out there for free or way under its worth.

As a chaser that sells footage and provides a service to media sources why in the hell would anybody want to give their product away for free. The media is out to do one thing. MAKE MONEY! Why give them something for little or nothing for them to profit off of YOU and YOUR HARD WORK! When you get your name mentioned for a few seconds and then people forget who you are moments later.

Bottom line this is going to kill footage sales. It is getting out of control. It needs to stop. If you have footage that is wanted and they won't come to an agreement do not sell it. If you don't know what your doing with handling the media and the stuff they will throw at you to low ball. Then use common sense and not your ego. If any media source contacts you and tries to get stuff for free or really cheap. Just think about how much money you make and how much more that company makes. You wouldn't go to work for free would ya? Then don't give out anything for free or cheap.

 

[Skip Talbot]

How many seconds were sold? If they bought more than a few seconds, that can add up to a good chunk of change.

Isn't this just supply and demand? Everyone has been saying it for awhile. The market is being saturated by footage. Prices are going to be dropping for footage the more there is that is coming in.

 

[Jeff Snyder]

I agree with Skip... This is completely supply and demand. Over the past 5-10 years, we've seen a large increase in supply of tornado video and only a small increase in demand. As such, the price drops. The person who sold the footage may have been ignorant, but perhaps he would have gotten $0 if the company decided not to purchase his video because they didn't want to spend the money for it. It stinks for those who want more money for their video, but it is what it is, and it's not going to reverse. Times have changed, and the market is now at the point where, if you offer what used to be the going rate 10 years ago, you'll probably be given a cold shoulder as the production company just seeks out video elsewhere and from others. Maybe getting their name in the credits and a couple tanks of gas paid for is good enough for them.

Of course, it's relatively easy for me to say this, since I don't do much with media sales (1-2 per year). The first time I was approached, I got what accounts to chump change. As I've become more familiar with media sales, though, I've been able to "calibrate" my price for video (with help from past Stormtrack threads on video rates). However, if someone wants to give their footage away for a low price, there's nothing we can, nor do I think should, do about it. It stinks for us, but someone else made money off of it. I can't tell someone that he or she should not accept an offer below a certain amount -- it's their video and their income. Again, stinks for me, but that's the way it goes.

 

[Brett Adair]

If they only want a couple sec's of HD video....50-60/sec. However, like Jeff states...with supply comes demand. If they buy a couple minutes worth of footage...I could certainly see selling to them for 20-25 a second. If you want them to come back for more with such a demand, you will give them a decent price.

 

[Erik Burns]

The amount of video sold from what I heard was 4 to 6.5 seconds.

 

[Scott Weberpal]

Bottom line this is going to kill footage sales. It is getting out of control. It needs to stop. If you have footage that is wanted and they won't come to an agreement do not sell it.

This isn't going to kill video sales, there will always be a demand; however, COMPETITION will significantly curtail prices from what they COULD be without 50 people all trying to market video from the same event. Sorry, but there were a TON of chasers fairly close to the Aurora tornado and I'm sure a few don't care exactly how much they make from it.

I'll tell you this much, I sold them 63 seconds from this event and gave them a good rate (nowhere as low as what you described though) because they went over a minute.

Face it, the days of making $10k or more a year on a fantastic tornado video were over a few years ago, and unless you get fantastic jaw-dropping video, getting the rate you want may be just as difficult. Supply and demand dictates the market, if other chasers are willing to supply and a lower cost, the need for YOUR video is going way down. It's part of life.

 

[Jeremy Den Hartog]

So do you guys think this kind of market trend will continue? I sure hope not as it seems storm chasing is kind of a 'fad' right now - thanks in part to the show 'storm chasers'. Maybe in the next few years supply will decrease again and then market value will go up again. Also, I would guess the relatively slow chase year probably played a role as well. In a busy year the amount of chasers would maybe be spread out more so less 'supply' for a specific storm...

 

[Jeff Snyder]

In a busy year the amount of chasers would maybe be spread out more so less 'supply' for a specific storm...

I've thought the same, but I'm not so sure that happens in practice... 2004 was about as active of a year as storm chasers can hope for, and there were a myriad of chasers on the later events (e.g. 6/12/04 Mulvane tornado, etc). Some chasers may gamble less in the active years (for example, I stayed home on 5/24/04 since I had a lot of things to catch up on as a result of chasing frequently in the preceding few weeks), but I don't think there are going to be many chase days on which you are one of only a few chasers out there. Honestly, the only way I can see the number of chasers dropping is if gas goes back up above $3.50-$4.00/ga. Unless (or until) that happens, I just can't see there being a lack of tornado footage.

Of course, as noted by others previously, you may get some exceptional or unique footage that may demand a greater price, but those times seem to be few and far between (particularly for those who don't want to get within 10' of a tornado ). Like Scott, I also sold video of the 6/17 Aurora tornado, at a rate that is 2-3 times what the OP mentioned, and in SD only. The chaser who sold the footage sounds like he could have gotten quite a bit more (then again, do we know how good the video was? Perhaps it was shaky and didn't really capture the tornado well), but that's his loss.

 

[Skip Talbot]

Chasing definitely isn't a fad. Its been a growing field for decades. Shows like Storm Chasers and movies like Twister, are probably a product of this growing popularity instead of the other way around (although I'm sure they are contributing). Chasing will continue to increase in popularity as the technology and public awareness increases making it easier to enter the hobby. Prices for footage will continue to fall also. As the technology increases, obtaining high quality footage will be easier and there will be more chasers out there capturing it. I imagine on a more active year, the supply will go up all around for storm footage, while demand may raise only in local markets.

 

[Dan Robinson]

With stock video, you just have to let the lowballers do their thing. It only hurts themselves. Most production companies have the money and they know what it would cost them to get the material themselves.

When they get a lowballer, they laugh all the way to the bank. They are prepared to pay decent rates, but if someone gives their stuff away, they will let them! They know this now and will start negotiations with those low rates. When they actually get someone to go for it, there are some high fives going on in their offices. They just got themsleves a nice end of year bonus.

Guys, take it from someone who has done this for over 6 years now. Supply and demand does not apply to stock footage. TWC, Discovery, National Geographic, etc are not out to produce garbage as cheaply as possible. It costs what it does to shoot footage, the production companies know it, and are prepared to pay. You are just simply not going to make every sale. If they like video from chaser A, they will buy it even if chaser B waves their arms in the air a with $50 rate. As long as you charge a fair rate, they will buy. Most of the bigger companies are this way. They go with what they like and what will help their product look good. If you sell to a major production for $200, you only have yourself to blame. It didn't need to be that way. Especially if they called *you*. They likely would have paid you a fair rate if you had set it to begin with.

And don't take all my talk as someone trying to 'inflate the market' . That's a bunch of bull, it doesn't make a difference what I say and this is not my full-time job that I depend on that I'd need to do that anyway. This business will never again be what it was 10 years ago, no one will never make a full-time living on it. But that is no reason to let someone profit off of you while you don't see profit yourself. It costs what it costs to get tornado footage, anyone who wants to use it and profit from that should pay for it.

For national broadcast shows, your minimums should start at the $1200-1500 range. Don't charge per second unless the order goes over 10-15 seconds. At least a grand per license is what you should be getting *minimum*. For large amounts of footage, say over 2-3 minutes, you should be seeing numbers around $3,000-$5,000 or more. If someone offers $200 you should laugh at them just like Best Buy would if you tried to pull that with a plasma TV in their store.

 

[Chris Wilburn]

A friend of mine ( who is a very well known chaser ) calls me today and gives me news of a couple of chasers that sold HD Aurora Tornado footage from fairly close rang destroying a structure. Turns out these chasers pretty much gave the footage away to the TWC program "Storm Stories" for $17.00 and $22.00 a second. This has fired up several chasers, including myself. I for one do not make a living storm chasing. I do like to make supplemental income from my chasing to help with chasing and other expenses. Now Storm Stories has contacted my good friend and the best offer they made for his HD tornado footage is around the digits as mentioned earlier! He offered another low amount back but higher than 22 and they declined his offer saying it was too steep.

So is your HD close up tornado video worth more to you than 17-22 bucks a second? People need to stop giving stuff away for free. Yes there will always be the guys who does something ignorant just to get his name out there for free or way under its worth.

As a chaser that sells footage and provides a service to media sources why in the hell would anybody want to give their product away for free. The media is out to do one thing. MAKE MONEY! Why give them something for little or nothing for them to profit off of YOU and YOUR HARD WORK! When you get your name mentioned for a few seconds and then people forget who you are moments later.

Bottom line this is going to kill footage sales. It is getting out of control. It needs to stop. If you have footage that is wanted and they won't come to an agreement do not sell it. If you don't know what your doing with handling the media and the stuff they will throw at you to low ball. Then use common sense and not your ego. If any media source contacts you and tries to get stuff for free or really cheap. Just think about how much money you make and how much more that company makes. You wouldn't go to work for free would ya? Then don't give out anything for free or cheap.

It sounds like these folks are just out to get their stuff on television to tell everybody about it. If it really was only 5-6 seconds they sold well that is just insane. It sure isn't worth the $100 or so that they apparently made off the video. I have read these threads before and even looked at Dan Robinson's website for the prices he suggests.

I sent some of my Picher video to a production company that is doing "Storm Stories" for the Weather Channel. I have a price ready to quote them if they are interested. It is close to the range that Dan posted above. If they want to "low ball" me well that is just too bad. They can find somebody willing to give it away for a couple hunderd dollars if they want. I could really care less if my video is on television or not. I sold this same Picher footage to another company for the price I am going to quote "Storm Stories" and basically got what I wanted. I know this was a unique event & not many chasers had video of the Picher tornado. I admit that if it wasn't for having to stay close to home, (I live 5 miles from Picher) I would have been in Arkansas or eastern Oklahoma with the other chasers. I just liked the setup there better. The video wasn't even that great as it was filmed from roughly 4 miles away. Don't think that having your video on television is going to do anything for you. Only the people you inform about your video is going to know it's yours for the most part. Oh you might see your name fly by at the end as the credits roll, but what is that really going to do for you?

I have only been chasing for about 5 years now, but I see this becoming the "norm" for sure. There are so many people out there chasing now. This means more video & more people willing to sell it dirt cheap to be able to tell their friends & family their video made television. If I sell this video to "Storm Stories" it will only be my second video sale I have ever made. I don't see myself selling any video for a very long time because of what I previously mentioned about the market being saturated.

 

[Andrea Griffa]

I think it's time for us to reach a standard agreement about the possible prices of an HD video: we should decide among ourselves the list price for every kinda footage, once for all.
This is just to prevent that every chasers produce a too high oscillation of prices, that is bad.

Actually it's normal that the price differ among the chasers even because there are better chasers, there are more and less experienced chasers, there are more lucky chasers that could be in the right place at the right time to get an incredible shot of a strong-violent tornado. And I'm sure this oscillation is physiological. As to me the important is to not bring down too much an hypothetical price of a good movie we've just filmed. And in order to do that we have to institute a base level price to not bring down, when we are contacted by an hypothetical television broadcast. Maybe Dan, or anyone with experience in this could help me.

I would suggest these points about the standard features that should have a video in order to be sold at a standard price:

-The video is good, well exposed, "not too moved", not blurry, and you filmed the tornado not too far away (within 5-6 miles) with an HD camera.

- Remember that if you filmed the tornado destroying a house or anything like that it's rated higher than a normal tornado in open field; I know it's sad but true (that's a fXXXXX television rule).

- If you filmed an "heroic tornado movie" such as tvn's incredible footages the price could be higher.

- If you filmed a inside tornado movie it'r rated higher than a normal tornado movie, but you can't do that unless you own a Tiv or a dominator, or you're insane :-D

Now, what would be the standard price for a tornado video? And if the movie was sensational with strong tornado impacting a human building? Try to give me some considerations.

 

[Jason Boggs]

Myself, chasing for a TV station here in Amarillo, I really don't get paid specifically for the video that I supply them. But, I'm not in it for the money either. They do pay me, but it covers my gas bill for the chases, and that's good enough for me. I also get paid if I don't supply them with video. Basically, I get paid to be out covering the weather for them whether I see something or not. I would be out in it anyway, so why not get my gas money in return. I think it's a fair trade. You may say I'm giving the video away, but I don't look at it that way. I scratch their back, and they scratch mine.

 

[Mikel Shively]

I think it's time for us to reach a standard agreement about the possible prices of an HD video: we should decide among ourselves the list price for every kinda footage, once for all.

I seriously don't think this will ever work... Someone is always going to lowball... people are independent, and someone will always low-ball to get their name out, or to get a few bucks or whatever...

My point is...yes, it's a really good idea in theory, but I have serious doubt's that it could ever work in practice.

 

[Chris Wilburn]

Myself, chasing for a TV station here in Amarillo, I really don't get paid specifically for the video that I supply them. But, I'm not in it for the money either. They do pay me, but it covers my gas bill for the chases, and that's good enough for me. I also get paid if I don't supply them with video. Basically, I get paid to be out covering the weather for them whether I see something or not. I would be out in it anyway, so why not get my gas money in return. I think it's a fair trade. You may say I'm giving the video away, but I don't look at it that way. I scratch their back, and they scratch mine.

Jason I totally understand this as I chase for a location TV station as well. I was mainly talking about video being played nationally by Discovery, Weather Channel etc. Just like you, I don't get paid much to chase for a TV station, but it does pay for my gas so I figure that is well worth it. Most of the video we supply at my station is mostly wind, rain, flooding & snow for example. This is nothing unique at all and is only aired by the local station. I don't chase for the money either. I chase because I love all kinds of weather, esp. supercells & tornadoes. I do think if you are supplying tornado video to a national network you should be paid well for it that's all.