Another Black Eye For Chasers?

[Shane Adams]

Don't come to NW Kansas...laughable. I gotta have this guy's email so I can tell him not to come to Oklahoma. Then again, considering his close-minded 'tool' attitude, he's probably never left the county and couldn't be happier (or prouder) about it. I wanna know what he drives, so the next time I'm up his way, I can pull over and ask him what's going on with the weather. I'll tell him I'm a chaser about a minute into the conversation.

I gotta have this guy's email, I can't stand it. I can't just sit by while ignorance of this magnitude runs amuck out there......I can at least try to make him understand. If he still resists, then I'll ask him how it feels to be a misguided a$$hole who's pride is gonna get himself or someone else killed one night.

 

[Damon Poole]

The real black eye to chasing and spotting, is the fact that all of us forget that we're all trying to learn the science of severe weather, and to help advance the science the best way we can. And, as someone correctly replied to this post, we also try to have fun with it, some going solely for the thrill. There's nothing wrong with that.

My point was, and is, that bashing and criticizing each other, whether you're a chaser, or a spotter, does nothing but damage the good image of both. Why don't we all work together to stop this stupid turf war mentality that always surfaces in these posts whenever some uninformed outsider makes stupid comments in an e-mail? Most of us, whether spotter or chaser, at least try, to contribute to the science, and the warning process in our own way. I think it's high time we all stop this rediculous and false superiority complex that divides chasers and spotters alike. We should be educating each other, and, the uninformed about what both groups do. The only way to stop the cops and the public from thinking chasers and spotters don't contribute anything, is to stop sniping and start cooperating, while acting professionally, safely and responsibly.

The cops shouldn't have to tell any of us to pull completely clear of the highway, or to keep from disturbing the peace in order to get the right shot. We should be doing this by ourselves. Showing a little bit of responsibility is a great way to stop the critics in their tracks, and keep the cops from trying to stop chasing altogether.

That's my .02 cents.

 

[Patrick Marsh]

Why is it that cops get hit by tornadoes all the time and chasers never do?

Be careful making generalizations...

I know of several threads from this year alone of chasers being "hit" by tornadoes.

 

[Mikey Gribble]

I don't mean for the cops getting hit by tornadoes comment to insinuate that all cops are ignorant to the workings of a storm and are a danger to themselves when spotting. I just wanted to point out the obvious statistic that cops get hit all the time. I can think of three or four incidents just over the last couple months where a cop got nailed by a tornado. Yeah there have been a couple groups of chasers that got hit this year, but the number of chasers that get hit is far below the number of emergency workers that get hit and I believe there is an obvious reason for it. Chasers on average are much more knowledgeable at all levels when it comes to storms and as a result they are able to keep themselves safe while other less knowledgeable (on average) spotters (cops) are much less likely to keep themselves safe, which is shown in the numbers of cops getting hit relative to chasers. My point in saying that was this, if chasers on average are more knowledgeable about storms, then I think it is pretty audacious of this guy to make generalizations of false reports when if anything past experience shows emergency workers are much more likely to provide inaccurate reports.
I would love to sit down and talk to this guy. I would give ten to one odds that he has never even read an Intro. to meteorology book, but he acts like he's a champ when it comes to reporting on the weather. I wonder if he can tell when a storm is going outflow dominant, or if he knows what kind of structure and storm behavior is usually a prelude to a storm going tornadic, or if he even knows any of the basics on storm scale and mesoscale meteorology. Ignorance is bliss. I'm with Shane. I would love to send that guy an email too. I have always had a problem letting things that I think are unbelieveably wrong go without arguing my side first.

 

[Mike Hollingshead]

I guess if I lived there, didn't find storms interesting, I'd probably feel the same exact way. If someone e-mailed me saying how they were there to help, I'd probably find that funny as well, when there are 200 others around. We're all there to "thrillseek"(I put quotes, don't go there) first and foremost. Of course we'll help, but really, no one is leaving town any distance with helping as the priority, or as their main reason for leaving. So I guess, trying to convey you are such a helper seems sort of silly when the compaint is that there are a billion of you around. Leaving and staying away would be helping in those cases.

It's just nice it doesn't really matter. Sorry Jimbo. You are stuck with us. And since when does the law have to stop more important matters to help someone out of mud, especially when they know why they were there and that they asked for it?

 

[Shane Adams]

It's not that we're trying to convey we're helping so much as we're not in the wrong simply by BEING THERE. You know how many times a day I see emergency vehicles? And every time there's traffic all aorund for them to weave through. What's the difference? Oh, because we're on that backroad to chase instead of because we live there, it's not ok to be there? Is it ok for that teenage chick in the VW bug to be in the way of the ambulance because she's going to buy clothes at Hot Topic instead of driving to work? You see the point I'm making.

I refuse to feel guilty for BEING THERE. I yield to emergency vehicles and go out of my way to help if the situation arises. So this Jim guy & anyone who feels the same way he does can kiss my chasing, white a$$.

 

[Mikey Gribble]

By this guys reasoning cops and fireman don't deserve any credit either. Yeah, we may be thrill seakers and community service definitely isn't the driving factor that makes us chase, but we still deserve credit and respect for the service we perform regardless of whether or not it is our primary source of motivation. Cops and fireman aren't doing their jobs because they want to serve the community either. They are doing it because they get paid. Is this guy going to laugh in the face of a rescue worker when they try to explain the public service they perform? I doubt he would, but that isn't any different then him laughing at chasers.
What is the big deal with a couple hundred people coming into your county anyways? Did he have to drive a little slower for 10 minutes? Boo hoo. Somebody needs to tell this guy to pull his panties up and quit whining. If I knew where he lived I would be tempted to take a dump on his porch the next time I'm out there chasing.

 

[Glen Romine]

I guess if I lived there, didn't find storms interesting, I'd probably feel the same exact way. If someone e-mailed me saying how they were there to help, I'd probably find that funny as well, when there are 200 others around. We're all there to "thrillseek"(I put quotes, don't go there) first and foremost. Of course we'll help, but really, no one is leaving town any distance with helping as the priority, or as their main reason for leaving. So I guess, trying to convey you are such a helper seems sort of silly when the compaint is that there are a billion of you around. Leaving and staying away would be helping in those cases.

I agree with Mike. If you are looking for the public to thank you for chasing - you aren't likely to get it. For the most part, massive chaser convergence will be a hassle for local communties. A stressful situation of having severe weather approach your community is made all the more manic when hordes of distracted drivers all pour into town. We have all seen police busy pulling over chasers for driving violations - and maybe some of you think they should be doing that instead of watching the storms since apparently all chasers (even those on their first chase?) are 'experts' at storm observation, but the police, fire and spotter networks have the advantage of effective communications and can relay hazards to the public more effectively. Certainly, having two dozen chasers call 911 to report a brief tornado in an open field for a storm with an active tornado warning is not a great service to a community. It is more often appropriate to get the # for the local weather service office and call them instead. Every chaser that wants to help should travel with the list of NWS office numbers. If you get stuck in the mud - don't call 911 for help unless you have life threatening injuries. Call 411 and get the # for a local towing company.

Absolutely there are some chasers who are generous with helping out in terms of public safety and community assistance when a tornado strikes a community - but I'm not convinced their numbers are large relative to the number of chasers (including the masses made up of locals). Among long haul diehard chasers the numbers are probably better, but the community is a conglomerate of both - and you can't expect the public to distinguish between them or to have blinders on to the jacka$$ery displayed by a few.

 

[Greg Stumpf]

Consider this...

This BB talks about the "great service" that storm chasers provide, and how we do more good than harm. How much service did the storm chasers on the 22 May 2007 Hill City storm actually provide?

I have it from a very reliable source that the GLD WFO only received three real-time reports of the tornado on their call log. Two reports were from the Graham County SO. The other report was from one of the GLD meteorologists who was chasing the storm (via SpotterNetwork). Only one chaser (out of 100s) bothered to relay the tornado report to the NWS. Imagine that!

I find it fascinating that loads of chasers on this BB are complaining about the persons who wrote the letters/emails condemning the actions of the chasers, yet very few are realizing there is a much deeper issue here. Apparently, the "perception" (which does not necessarily equate to "reality") of chasers is starting to grow negative with certain public officials. Rather than b&c and attack those with these perceptions, it might serve better to actively persue ways to change these perceptions from negative to positive. Most of what I've read on this thread has been completely destructive critisicm and useless whining.

I say we do our best to build advocacy for the positive things that chasers can do to help. One such idea is to heavily market the Storms of 2007 DVD fundraiser in all the counties and communities that have been affected by these storms (e.g., Hill City). The Graham and Trego County S.O's might be very impressed with this and might reconsider some of their thoughts.

Another might be to offer assistance in local spotter training. Another might be to offer assistance with spotting, by teaming up with local officials to help them identify storm features in real-time. Another might be to get the local NWS severe weather reporting numbers programmed into your cell phones and make reports. Don't always assume that the report has already been made, and remember that updates are just as important as that first report of the tornado. Another means getting your 2m amateur radio license and a radio, and working with the local spotter groups. There are countless other things that could be done to bring chasers into a more positive light. But telling folks to KYA does nothing but to further drive a wedge (pardon the pun).

 

[Rob Herman]

Apparently many chasers were calling 911 and making their reports that was upsetting the dispatcher. The dispatcher also claimed he was receiving false reports.

Did anybody trying to report to GLD get a busy signal? If everyone calls at once only one is going to get through. If you observe a short lived tornado, make a call and get a busy signal, how many times should you try after the tornado has lifted? Did GLD call any of the chasers showing up on the spotter network?

 

[Dick McGowan]

Consider this...



I have it from a very reliable source that the GLD WFO only received three real-time reports of the tornado on their call log. Two reports were from the Graham County SO. The other report was from one of the GLD meteorologists who was chasing the storm (via SpotterNetwork). Only one chaser (out of 100s) bothered to relay the tornado report to the NWS. Imagine that!

Well, I neither work for the Sheriff's office nor am I a meteorologist, but I submitted "tornado" via spotter network with "3/4 to the ground approximately 2 miles to my north." ( I wasn't sure at that time if it had touched, but figured it warranted a tornado report.) This was as it was happening.

Eventhough I "figured" there were about 200 chasers out there, we did it anyways. It's so simple to submit a report, and can let a person continue chasing...if the forecast office has any questions they will definitely give you a call. Prior to the tornado, about 20 minutes before, someone from GLD called us, and Darin told them exactly what we were seeing. This happened in Pueblo's forecast office on 4/21, as well as Wichita's on 5/5.

 

[Mikey Gribble]

I may not have called in to GLD NWS, but I was on air for the tv station I chase for reporting on the Hill City tornado, so I was definitely doing my part. I was reporting on the storm all night as a matter of fact and that is part of the reason why I don't appreciate some guy that lives there saying that chasers aren't doing any good.
I also participate in public speaking events and tv weather specials every spring to educate the public on what exactly chasers do. BTW you also got my video for the Storms of 2005. There are a lot of jackasses out there, but I'm not one of them and the vast majority of serious chasers I know aren't either, so of course I am going to be offended when some guy basically says chasers are worthless.
I'm not sure where this dislike for chasers came from. I really don't think the general public feels that way. Every stranger I have ever talked to about chasing is fascinated and appreciative of what we do. God bless the Discovery Channel for giving us some positive coverage because it sure doesn't seem like anyone else is recently.

BTW how in the hell would the dispatcher know if somebody made a false report and doesn't a tornado constitute an emergency? I know I have seen very well known meteorologists/chasers calling 911 to report a tornado on tv shows before. Just in case anybody is wondering, no I wasn't one of the people that called 911.

 

[Joey Ketcham]

Did anybody trying to report to GLD get a busy signal? If everyone calls at once only one is going to get through. If you observe a short lived tornado, make a call and get a busy signal, how many times should you try after the tornado has lifted? Did GLD call any of the chasers showing up on the spotter network?

Well, Greg did say that GLD only received 3 reports... only 2 which I believe was by phone and the other one by Spotter Network... so obviously their phone line isn't going to be busy... at least not busy enough that you can't get through at all.

I have a list of NWS phone #'s that I take with me chasing, I've always had good luck getting through to them.

 

[Shane Adams]

Consider this...



I find it fascinating that loads of chasers on this BB are complaining about the persons who wrote the letters/emails condemning the actions of the chasers, yet very few are realizing there is a much deeper issue here. Apparently, the "perception" (which does not necessarily equate to "reality") of chasers is starting to grow negative with certain public officials. Rather than b&c and attack those with these perceptions, it might serve better to actively persue ways to change these perceptions from negative to positive. Most of what I've read on this thread has been completely destructive critisicm and useless whining.

Hey, I've wanted to do this for years...but you can't educate someone who doesn't want to be educated. I'm sorry (not really) if my refusal to coddle and "take the high road" with this issue is perceived by some as "whinng", but I'm tired of pissing in the wind. Jerks like this guy have their heads made up and it is what it is. I say "fine, be a jerk." I in no way ever try to make myself or any other chasers "heroes", but when issues like this one are raised, of course I'm going to point out some of the positive things from chasers....it's the only ammunition I have. If that still won't turn opinions, I got nothing left in the tank.

As for the St Peter (Hill City) tornado of May 22, I haven't owned a cell phone in years and don't have a HAM, so I have no way of making real-time reports. Does this mean I have no right to be out there? Of course not. When I'm capable of making reports, I do (and they aren't always appreciated BTW). Despite that, I still report when I am able, because public awareness is far more important than my pride (yes I know, shocking statement from me....I'll give you all a few moments to collect yourselves before I continue....)

I hate bringing up the 'good things' I've done as a chaser for public service (and believe me, my list is much longer and distinguished than I'll ever advertise on here), because I don't do it for recognition, I do it because that's what you're supposed to do when the situation arises....do what you can to help/warn/whatever for someone. But to then have that thrown back in my face by other chasers? I got nothing in response to that. The spotter types run us down, I defend us, and then other chasers tear me up for that defense. So be it, LOL. As I said, there's nothing further I know to do about it, other than just ignore it.

Because when I'm out chasing, none of this crap means anything. This is filler until the next time I'm out.

 

[Rob Herman]

There were only a couple of short lived touchdowns that evening. Spotters would tend to call all at the same time.

I looks like to me that they don't want "public" reports (that includes us), only from their spotters (people they know and are familiar with).

As for the "false reports" some agencies will send out someone to checkout the report if they don't see what was reported in it didn't happen.