Wind Farms showing up on weather radar

[Darren Addy]

Became aware of this thanks to an email from a NE Chaser. Seems like it might be something to keep in mind (and maybe for weather programs to permenantly mark on their maps?)

Sort of amazing to me: http://www.crh.noaa.gov/news/display_cmsstory.php?wfo=oax&storyid=64050&source=0

Anyone aware of similar situation with other radars/windfarms or other States?

 

[Scott Weberpal]

Yes, it has been an ongoing issue for many years at many offices.

http://www.erh.noaa.gov/buf/windfarm.htm
http://www.crh.noaa.gov/mkx/?n=windfarm
http://www.roc.noaa.gov/windfarm/how_turbines_impact_nexrad.asp
http://www.roc.noaa.gov/WSR88D/PublicDocs/NNOW/NNwinter093/WindFarms-Update.pdf
http://www.roc.noaa.gov/WSR88D/Publicdocs/2009iips_wef_final.pdf

 

[Skip Talbot]

Here's a discussion we had a couple years ago about wind farms on various radars:
http://www.stormtrack.org/forum/showthread.php?18568-Wind-Farms-Coming-Soon-to-a-WSR-88D-Near-You

 

[Matt Tottle]

DDC picks up 2 constantly, if it's particularly windy, it picks up a third one in Kiowa county.

I thought this one was particularly amusing. There was a freak snowstorm caused by steam stack exhaust (factory-effect snow!) a couple weeks ago, and they posted the radar loop from it. If you watch the road going southwest (Hwy 56), you can can see that the radar actually picked up a TRAIN as it moved along the tracks that parallel the road!

 

[ScottKoenig]

In the next 5-10 years areas in Western Kansas, Oklahoma, and Texas will have Wind Farms all over the place once the Transmission lines are built in these areas. Here is a map of proposed wind projects in Kansas http://www.kansasenergy.org/wind_project_map_utility.htm The Dodge City and Goodland radars might have false readings all around them once these projects are finished.

I created a custom place file to display the Wind Farms here in Kansas, the shot below shows the Dodge City Radar. When I get more time I need to update the place file for Texas, Oklahoma, Etc.

 

[Jim Saueressig]

Sadly they are about to put up an unknown number in Coffey County here in KS. They are supposed to stretch from about 16th RD and HWY 75 North and East to the county lines. There have been about 3 proposed locations here in CF alone. What a waste of photo ops on my skyline.

 

[TrumanBoyer]

"Altoona Wiggle"

Thanks for putting up this thread. Me and some of my geek friends have been trying to get confirmation of this phenom, for about 2 months now !!

We starting noticing on TWC Local Radar (we're in the Western PA/MD/WV area) an oscillating area of pseudo-precipitation just south of Altoona, PA. We would see it from time to time, and wonder what was wrong. We started calling it the "Altoona Wiggle", and after about a week or two I realized that there is a large area of wind farms, along the highest ridge tops in the Allegheny Mountains, largely between PA Routes 219 and 160 extending to north of the PA Turnpike, corresponding to the area where we see the wiggle. Seemed Like more than a coincidence! Thanks again for posting !

Probably millions of people see this on the radar, -- Anybody else seen it ?

Just Wondering - Truman

 

[czenzel]

This is very interesting. I always wondered about what causes a radar to have "spoofs" or misguidance in the data. I have seen two things throughout StormTrack's threads that cause radar interference including birds, insects, etc. and now with wind farms.

I am going to take a look at some data with GRLevel3.

Is NOAA planning to correct this or have they already?

I have a speech upcoming at my college, in Effective Speaking, and with my interest of going into weather I think this would be one great topic with sample data and how it happens. (I am sure most people won't understand it, but I'll try my best).

 

[rdale]

Is NOAA planning to correct this or have they already?

"Correct" is probably the wrong word to use, you can't eliminate the fact that the radar beam is being disrupted. However there are mitigation efforts in place, http://www.roc.noaa.gov/windfarm/how_turbines_impact_nexrad.asp

 

[czenzel]

"Correct" is probably the wrong word to use, you can't eliminate the fact that the radar beam is being disrupted. However there are mitigation efforts in place, http://www.roc.noaa.gov/windfarm/how_turbines_impact_nexrad.asp

Thanks! I see the link at the bottom of the page about "mitigation" and research into the problem. I guess this is going to be common and we should just be aware of possible wind farms in our radar location's path.

I did some Google Searching and found a radar wind farm placefile on one of the GRLevelX sites. I am looking forward to see what others have to contribute to this mater.

Placefiles: http://www.grlevelxstuff.com/index.php?categoryid=14&p13_sectionid=3

So if I understand correctly the radar beams bounce off of the wind turbine's fan and go upward causing a disturbance of a false warning or area of warning. Other laboratories and places are trying to research ways the wind fan can change the way radar waves are bounced. For now currently these wind farms cause fake echos and/or warnings.

I am guessing consumer and local area (municipal) grade wind turbines are not going to cause any problems anytime soon since they sit way less to the ground compared to wind farms.

 

[rdale]

Great training right on the WDTB homepage now - http://www.wdtb.noaa.gov/modules/windfarms/index.html

 

[czenzel]

Great training right on the WDTB homepage now - http://www.wdtb.noaa.gov/modules/windfarms/index.html

Thanks for the link. It looks like it is training for more advanced radar users, etc., but I take a look at it.

 

[John Wetter]

Surprised to see this thread, I thought the topic was pretty well established and understood... This link is a siteline for the 88D's from the ROC. Any wind farms within the first or second color band from the radar site would fairly consistently show blockage of the radar beam: http://www.roc.noaa.gov/WSR88D/WindFarm/LineOfSightMap.aspx?wid=dev

 

[Greg Higgins]

czenzel: Sadly that GR placefile you found is way out of date. Here in the FWD area alone, we have over half a dozen "new" (over the past 2 years) wind farms that are not in that placefile. I have cutomized a placefile just for the FWD radar but it would be nice if we could all colloborate to keep one main placefile updated on a regular basis.

 

[czenzel]

czenzel: Sadly that GR placefile you found is way out of date. Here in the FWD area alone, we have over half a dozen "new" (over the past 2 years) wind farms that are not in that placefile. I have cutomized a placefile just for the FWD radar but it would be nice if we could all colloborate to keep one main placefile updated on a regular basis.

Thanks for letting me know. I haven't got a chance to try it out, but if it is out of date I guess I won't be trying it out. I am looking for sample data to see about wind farms and radar sites. Thanks for letting me know.