Storm spotter among the newton county fatalities.

[Brandon Lawson]

I'm not sure if anyone else has talked about this yet, but apparently, a spotter was killed by the tornado that went through Racine, MO. My dad is a minister for the Seneca Christian Church, and also works part-time as a Chaplain for the Freeman Hospital in Joplin. I guess he sometimes will go over to St. John's Hospital as well. He was in the emergency rooms last night.

The guy was in his early twenties, and a volunteer firefighter who was acting as a spotter on Saturday. I don't know much about how spotters work. I just know they generally have a specific spot that they sit and watch as the storm approaches. Don't they usually have a radio with them, so that , in addition to giving out warnings, they can be warned themselves to move out of the way if a storm happens to move in their direction? The racine storm took quite a turn, and at the speed that the storms were moving I wouldn't be surprised if this guy was caught in the path before he even realized what was going on. Really a sad deal.

My dad was actually at the church at the time, which is on the north end of Seneca. He went outside to see what he could see as the storm crossed Hwy 43, but only saw rain. There is a good chance that the tornado was rain-wrapped. This just made me wonder how informed spotters are while they are out.

 

[John Wetter]

This just made me wonder how informed spotters are while they are out.

I think this can run all the way from very informed with a lot of radar data and radio updates to "get out there and let us know what you see" and then silence until the storm passes. In our area at least, I'd say the fire/EMA people probably have less information than the ham operators do.

-John

 

[Tim Shriver]

I think this can run all the way from very informed with a lot of radar data and radio updates to "get out there and let us know what you see" and then silence until the storm passes. In our area at least, I'd say the fire/EMA people probably have less information than the ham operators do.

-John

I agree. It runs from well informed, supported and educated to
those that scare the hell out of me.

Our group just started using ham radios, we had been using a business band
radio system and still use and maintain that system to this day. So we are not hams that spot weather, but rather weather nuts with radios. We meet every month year round.

Some ham repeaters groups frown on "active nets" where radar information
is given out and positioning of spotters is done. They feel it is a liability to the repeater. We ran into that here.
Thus we have our own ham and business band repeaters and have very
active nets and are very structured.

I feel the more information you can supply a spotter the better the
decisions they can make.

I am a Skywarn member, have been for years, but the program has a flaw.
The training and abilities of Skywarn spotter varies greatly from place to place and person to person.

Some wouldn't know a RFD from a dust devil. Others could teach meteorology
at the local university. Some think they are a spotter after one 2 hour NWS class. Others take it upon themselves to further their weather related education.

In my mind the days of the once a year trained spotter is coming to an end as others see that it takes more then this to accurately and safely spot
a severe storm/tornado.

Like I have said to many, almost anyone can identify a tornado, but the
good ones can identify where one might form before it does.

Tim

 

[Shane Adams]

This is another situation like last year on May 4 with the police officer. You have someone out there, in extremely severe conditions (aka violent tornadoes at night or very fast-moving) who simply doesn't have the experience to deal with it. They're out there because they are trying to do their best to help warn the people they care about; i.e. their towns and surrounding areas. It's indeed a noble thing. But the frightening reality is, it is extremely dangerous, and at times, can end tragically.

I agree SKYWARN is flawed, but in all fairness, there's not much else you can do besides set a bunch of people down in a room and try to explain this stuff to them orally and with slides/film. Only experience will truly teach them, and they simply don't get enough. Even when they do, they're worried about warning citizens and getting their reports heard over the airwaves, they're not sitting there transfixed on the storm/tornado trying to understand what's happening. So even the little real-world experience doesn't garner much knowledge.

I hate hearing about things like this. I know some of those people don't even want to be out there, but they feel it's their responsibility or perhaps even part of their job (the young THP we encountered May 6 wanted no part of being around tornadoes or severe storms). I just hope this young man was out there because he wanted to be, and not because he felt obligated. I would hate to think he was scared anyway, and then had something so horrible happen to him. I like to think he was enjoying himself and doing his best, and never saw it coming.

 

[Elinor McLennon]

Our city does an excellent job at keeping us informed when we are out spotting/chasing. I have been very impressed at how well these guys relay info to us ham operators. They ALWAYS know where we are, give us moment by moment updates, have us do damage assessment and then clear off the air when things have settled down. We have all taken the spotter classes from NWS and most of us study on our own and spot/chase as often as we can for experience.
My prayers go out for this young man's family and I also hope that he was doing something that he loved instead of feeling obligated to be out there. May everyone stay safe and thanks for all you do.

 

[Joey Ketcham]

This is from Geoff Cornish, meteorologist at KOAM-TV here in the Pittsburg, KS/Joplin, MO market:

A storm spotter / volunteer firefighter from the Seneca, MO Rural Fire Protection District has died today as a result of injuries from Saturday's EF4 tornado in western Newton County, MO. Tyler Casey was spotting at Highway 43 and Iris Road in western Newton County, and his vehicle was tossed by the winds. He was pulled from the vehicle and was on life support until this (Monday) morning.

This was a Line-Of-Duty-Death in the fire service, as his firefighting responsibilites with Rural Seneca Fire led him - and others - out spotting.

Tyler is survived by a two year old daughter.

I spoke with his fire training instructor around midday, and he said that Tyler was a tremendous firefighter -- one of the best, most 'up and coming' young guys in Newton County. His instructor said that Tyler was one who always put others first.

As meteorologists -- we know how much we rely on the information spotters give us. He was helping the public at large when he sustained those injuries.

 

[Brandon Lawson]

Thanks for posting that Joey. I wish I knew more information about what happened, but there is the possibility that no one will ever know. It's just so frustrating, especially the more I think about it, at how easy it is for chasers to monitor base reflectivity, and velocity couplets on radar, and at the same time the general public has no clue. It's all anyone would need on them to easily steer clear of bad storms.

Would it be prudent to require spotters to have mobile internet and grlevel3 (or some type of radar program)? That alone would improve their ability to know where to look while sitting somewhere. This would improve their spotting ability, and also allow them to know when to get out of the way.

 

[Ben Holcomb]

Where are you going to get the money to equip all spotters with mobile radar? That requires a data plan of some sort, it requires laptops and purchasing GRLevel3 or some other radar software. It isn't economically feasible for most locations. We had to go through so much red tape to even get radar data from our city emergency management for use in the EOC.

 

[Tim Shriver]

Where are you going to get the money to equip all spotters with mobile radar? That requires a data plan of some sort, it requires laptops and purchasing GRLevel3 or some other radar software. It isn't economically feasible for most locations. We had to go through so much red tape to even get radar data from our city emergency management for use in the EOC.

I agree..also remember Radar is showing the history
of a stiorm cell, not the present or the future.

A spotter should:

1. Never go out alone. Take or have a partner with you.
2. Should be part of a GOOD spotter group with radio communications.
3. Learn all they can before going out.

I do think the NWS should have some sort of testing or meaningful certification program for both the spotter and the spotter group.
Enforce some sort of standards.

Tim

 

[rdale]

I do think the NWS should have some sort of testing or meaningful certification program for both the spotter and the spotter group.
Enforce some sort of standards.

Then nobody would do it...

 

[Joey Ketcham]

I just want to say, before we get into any debates about spotters lack of experience, training, technology, etc.. that we remember the handful of chasers who ended up in a tornado during the past couple years, including myself. Even having mobile internet, radar, etc.. some of us still found ourselves in a very dangerous situation and could have easily lost our life.

I've heard of more storm chasers getting caught in tornadoes than storm spotters, so don't think it's fair to point fingers at this spotter blaming it on lack of training, experience, or anything.. he just happened to get caught in a situation that a handful of us have been in but was less fortunate and didn't survive. I can think of a few chasers right here on this forum that found themselves in a tornado, and as I said I'm among one and it was my fault and learned a very valuable lesson that day. Point being, nobody is perfect and even the most experienced storm chasers can find themselves in a very bad situation.

 

[Tim Shriver]

Then nobody would do it...

You might be surprised....Just like when ARES/RACES
made being IC100 and IC700 certified a requirement. Folks said no one would do it.
But many did and it appears the folks that did are the better, more involved
and useful folks. The ones they did not were the slackers.

Tim

 

[Tim Shriver]

Joey Said "so don't think it's fair to point fingers at this spotter blaming it on lack of training, experience, or anything.."

I agree, as I said some are not well trained and others are very well trained.
I run into this every year. Most of our 60 spotters do very well, but there
are a handful that just worry me sick.

Even the best trained spotter can find themselves in a bad situation, but proper
and complete training, along with a proper support structure will reduce the chances of this happening.

Tim

 

[Chris Harrell]

Certainly all spotter groups have different ways of conducting things. I looked into my local spotter group for Ellis County here in Texas a while back while going through Skywarn Spotter Training.

You must join the local R.A.C.E.S in order to be a spotter in Ellis County. It is not a requirement to have a HAM radio, but they do ask for a cell phone number on the application. There is a detailed map that puts each spotter in a specific location, so it's not just a free for all activity. In addition they must go through basic and advanced spotter training. This is about as much as I know about the local spotter group, because I have not joined it yet.

Whether you like it or not, spotters are not something that are needed 365 days a year, so it's hard for these cities/counties to get fundings to give every spotter a laptop, mobile internet, and GPS.

Do you think the NWS will pony over the money? Of course not. These are volunteers and nothing more...anything that they have to use must be provided at their expense. These are not serious storm chasers by any means and a vast majority have little to no equipment.

No one here knows the details of what occurred and what this man's training/equipment even was. I'd encourage people to worry more about this man's family and community than how ill equipped or trained he was.

 

[Tim Shriver]

Chris said "You must join the local R.A.C.E.S in order to be a spotter in Ellis County"

Hmm,, thats odd since Skywarn is a NWS/NOAA entity and not controlled by ARES/RACES.


As for the spotters family I am very sorry for their loss as with any death. As far
as I know the person might of been a very well trained spotter.

I was simply responding to the orignal posters comment of "This just made me wonder how informed spotters are while they are out".

Tim