Storm Reporting Problems and Proposals

[rdale]

The 800# is a national, single number for anyone to call. It routes your report right to AWIPS and pops up on the end-user screen.

My concern with FF's is that a LARGE number of them never are called to spot. Ever. Big city FF's don't man the rigs and head out for a tornado. I applaud Randy's push - but I still don't believe the NFPA would require every firefighter to be a certified weather spotter before they could join the FDNY.

 

[Bill Tabor]

So far I don't have that 800 number, and as far as I know no other chasers or Spotternetwork has it either. I guess we'll all have to see if it's appropriate for chasers / mobile spotters to call in the new scheme of things or if they prefer other alternatives.

 

[rdale]

I posted that a few months ago, http://stormtrack.org/forum/showthread.php?t=22761

Also the plan for the Skywarn spotter database was mentioned at NSWW. It's not an overhaul of Skywarn - just an improved method of training and storing the spotter's information in a national database.

http://www.norman.noaa.gov/nsww/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/TanjaFransen_NSWW2010.pdf

 

[Bill Tabor]

Thanks Dale for providing those links. Guess I missed it earlier (off season). NPOP is an automated line. Wonder if you can send text message reports to it as well? I also wonder how it is expected to be used and what NWS prefers Spotters, Chasers to use. Is this primarily for the general public? I suppose it's a good secondary if you don't have a direct line to talk with someone. Perhaps Randy, Tanja, etc will explain what they feel is the proper approach. I've been updating the NWS phone numbers for Street Atlas and GR3 but likely this task / responsibility needs to be pushed back to the government side of things. It was an un-met need I saw that I knew how to resolve so I acted. Probably having me dealing with it long term isn't the best policy however.

 

[rdale]

It's intended for the general public - but if you can't get a hold of the NWS using other means then it's certainly something to use as a backup.

 

[Mike Johnston]

If a single standard training module is implemented, I hope there is some way to retain/factor in localized information. For example, a few years ago I attended an excellent training session presented by the Kansas City (Pleasant Hill) NWS staff. They spent some time going over the fact the area tends to experience a number of HP storms, the practical challenges this presents to spotters, amongst other issues characteristic of the local environment. I just think having that local professional forecaster there, in person, is an important element in the training and hope it isn't lost.

 

[Greg Higgins]

I would like to throw in another concern, one that I have seen occur over the years and which had a major impact. That is the use of the word "certification". Many years ago, both the American Red Cross (ARC) and American Heart Association (AHA) would teach first aid and CPR courses and then issue a "certification card". This practice came to a screaming halt when "certified" people were sued for providing aid to a victim and the victim had a bad outcome, through no fault of the "certified" caregiver. Both the ARC and AHA were also sued and after a few years, removed the word "certification" from their training literature, course descriptions and cards. As a Regional Falculty with the AH for many years, we were directed to ensure that instructors and courses were not referred to as "certified" in any shape, form or manner, a student simply completed a "course of instruction" and were issued a "course completion card".

This was all based on legal and monetary concerns. The word certification in the professional world pertains to "Certifications earned from a Professional society and, in general, must be renewed periodically, or may be valid for a specific period of time (e.g., the life-time of the product upon which the individual is certified). As a part of a complete renewal of an individual's certification, it is common for the individual to show evidence of continued learning — often termed continuing education — or earning continuing education units (CEU)." It also implies that the person being certified have a monetary investment in the process.

Another concern is that they agency granting such a certification be a national recognized agency.

In todays world, I can easily see the following scenario: a "certified" spotter / chaser calls in a tornado causing the local EM / NWS to sound warning sirens / issue a tornado warning which in turn closes down a business because the business wants to protect their employees. After "x" amount of time when no tornado arrives because the "certified" spotter / chasers report was inaccurate / faulty / etc., the business decides to sue the EM / NWS and whoever else to recoup lost money and productivity. I know that several of you on this forum will take great delight and tell me how stupid this is, have at it, but do a little research yourself...this sort of stuff happens all of the time. And granted that in reality, EM, city / county governments / NWS get sued all of the time but rarely lose. They still have to defend themselves which costs time and money.

A valid solution to consider is to follow the path that the ARC and AHA (and others) did and that is to simply provide a "course completion card". An ID number and other information can be included, but just get rid of the word "certification" and all that it implies. Are there other solutions? Sure! This is just one opinion in trying to head off problems down the road.

 

[Zach Borst]

I would bet that if businesses were going to sue over false alarms this would have occurred a long time ago. As far as getting responders to get trained, I am working with my university's emergency management and the NWS near me (I have an internship at both) and am about to finish the "storm ready" certification for my university. At first there was some trouble getting people on board with getting skywarn training and other storm ready requirements. I did a presentation to the emergency management board and told them that this is a responder safety issue. The chiefs ate this up. Originally the police and other agencies were going to provide the skywarn training as a volunteer option, after my presentation they made it required and paid OT for the responders.

Randy and everyone he is working with are doing a great job getting this off the ground and have addressed many issues not even discussed here. Randy is also looking at this from a firefighters point of view. Fire service training is just starting to go to the national level for the same reason that skywarn is going national. With many certifications now you can go all over the country and your certification will be recognized. EMS is pretty much the same.

 

[Paul Hadfield]

Here in IL [or at least the Chicago NWS] they don't issue spotter IDs. I think a uniform system needs to be implemented across the nation before complete order and understanding could be achieved. I don't know what NWSs issue IDs and which don't or whether the "spotter ID" is something that requires additional certification or not.

I would think that if this ID is to be viewed as such a critical piece of info [for some offices] then they should all go ahead and issue them.

Interesting you would mention this Adam, I figured LOT would have been doing the same as down here. ILX went with this system where upon completion of an official spotter class, the individual is issued a unique 4 digit number. When calling in a report, the person states their name and four digit ID so to establish immediate credibility. From what I have heard over time, they like the ID for being able to weed out the untrained. The ID/card system has also been useful in dealing with LEO's who during a couple of events I was out spotting for would ask for some form of proof.