Mount Hood Climbing Tragedy

[Larry J. Kosch]

I've been following the tragic story about the three missing climbers that apparently met their fate on Mount Hood this past weekend:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation...ies+(News+-+Top+Stories)&utm_content=My+Yahoo

Following is a link to a website where climbers posted their views on this event:

http://www.summitpost.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=50416

It appears that all three climbers are experienced and know full well the dangers of climbing Mt. Hood in the winter. Yet they took chances in face of risks to their health and lives. At this time, one climber has been found dead at the 9,000 foot level and weather is getting worse for searchers.

My prayers are with the missing climbers.

MODS: If this is more suitable for the "Bar and Grill" section, you can move it. thanks. LJK.

Any discussions or opinions???

 

[rdale]

More people died this year in the US from mountain climbing (which offers no return for society) than storms spotter and chaser (which are part of an integral system that saves lives) deaths in the last 50 years. Any calls for regulation and banning?

 

[Larry J. Kosch]

State Legislation In the Works

rdale, if you read thru the USA TODAY article you would have read this:

Republican John Lim, a former legislator who's running for governor, said Sunday he plans to keep pushing for a state law to require mountaineers to carry electronic locator devices when they head for the summit of Mount Hood.

Either that or they can ban climbing on Mount Hood in the wintertime. That's almost like banning storm chasers from Tornado Alley in May!!

 

[Jim Saueressig]

Republican John Lim, a former legislator who's running for governor, said Sunday he plans to keep pushing for a state law to require mountaineers to carry electronic locator devices when they head for the summit of Mount Hood.

Not a bad idea really as long as the climber pays the bill, would save us a ton of money on search and rescue... And I am anti too much government lol

 

[Jason Foster]

I don't understand why the climbers didn't have location devices with them. I wouldn't go on a major boat expedition without an ePIRB. It just makes sense although I don't think it is required, like PFDs are.

I can see restrictions and regulations along the same lines as boating or other similar sports.

 

[MClarkson]

The human spirit to explore makes any calls for "banning mountain climbing" so ridiculous it really shouldn't be discussed. Besides, this is the land of the free, not North Korea.

Now, on to the more intelligent question "Why were they not carrying locater beacons?" Well theres a couple reasons. A beacon costs money and takes up weight. There are many other items a climber can carry that also increase safety, in addition to these mountain locater units. But at some point the increase in weight also slows a climber down. Increasing your speed also increases safety, both by reducing time exposed to danger and more importantly, getting off dangerous terrain before the afternoon sun heats things up. Then rockfall, icefall, and wet avalanches all increase significantly. So there is a balance, that each climber must decide for their themselves on any given climb, between speed and extra equipment. Also climbers do not have unlimited funds.

Keep in mind that MLUs do not help in the majority of cases. It will not save you if you are killed outright in a fall, a crevasse fall, hit by rock or ice, etc. Even worse, if the weather and avalanche conditions are bad enough to pin a team down, the conditions are also bad enough to stop the rescuers!

Now in this case the section of the mountain they were on is fairly hard. It is a bit steep, it is subject to serious icefall, and also rockfall, avalanches and crevasses are a bit of a concern. The weather has been bad but not terrible, the main problem being a lack of visibility at times and some avalanche risk. Now the technical details are a bit thin, from what i have heard the most experienced member of the party was the one that was injured(unknown cause) and then killed by exposure. There is some speculation that the other 2 went for help after deciding they could not lower the injured guy down the steep slopes on their own. After that their fate remains a total mystery, there are many things that could have happened. But now that we have had a bit of decent weather and they have not reappeared, it does not look good. With seriously bad weather arriving in the next few hours, whatever hope remained is rapidly dwindling.

 

[Chris Hayes]

Mountain climbing is one of those things I would love to try someday. I'm all for requiring climbers to carry GPS locators on them, AT THAT THEIR EXPENSE. Save a lot of money and probably lives.

 

[Jason Foster]

..... Well theres a couple reasons. A beacon costs money and takes up weight. ......

Rental is about $5 per day. That's not much considering a good climbing jacket runs $500 or more.

Weight is minimal.

 

[MClarkson]

A rental is 5$ per day at a few shops near Mt Hood, but those are beacons that only work on Mt Hood. To stock those shops, they would have to acquire hundreds of beacons to match summer demand if you were going to make every climber carry them. Plus the ground stations, etc. That money could be better spent on lets say... better forecasts? Proper mountain forecasts are usually very short range or non-existant for most peaks in the world. That costs a lot of lives because most climbers dont know how to grab the nearest bufkit profile.

The weight is not minimal when you start adding up all the things that also make a certain climb a little safer. Why not carry any number of other pieces of a gear that add a little bit to the safety margin? Why not a powerful radio? Why not a stove? Extra fuel? A shovel? Avalanche probe and beacons? Extra lights? An extra layer, or 5 extra layers? A bivy sack? Extra water? Extra food? Extra technical gear so you dont run out on a pitch or arent screwed when you drop something? A helmet? Rope and harness? An extra ice axe?

Because when you add all those things up now you are way too heavy to get to the top and back down to safer terrain before the sun heats up loose rocks and ice. Maybe you arent light and fast enough to get back down before darkness. Also you are exerting much more energy. Now instead of making your climb safer, you actually made it more dangerous, because as I said speed also makes things safer.

You cannot carry enough gear to mitigate every danger. You have to choose which pieces of equipment to carry. I would choose most of those items i just listed before an MLU.

 

[cstrunk]

A locating beacon should be a MUST for anyone wanting to climb dangerous mountains. It is TAXPAYER money that is used for the search and rescue (or recovery) process.

I'm sorry, but for those of you listing the drawbacks of carrying a few extra ounces in a locating beacon are crazy. This is probably the best item you can have so that you can be rescued in case something goes wrong. If you break a leg, rescuers could find you right away. Time is the most crucial aspect in these cases, IMO.

Anyone who chooses to climb a dangerous mountain without one of these devices and ends up needing to be rescued or recovered, should be liable for any associated costs.

 

[MClarkson]

First off, the ground teams are mostly volunteer climbers. Secondly, those helicopters are going to fly and burn fuel anyway. If there are no real rescues, they are eventually going to simulate some. So the costs of the rescues are not nearly as much as you think. Thirdly, most rescues are for hunters, fishers, skiiers/boarders, and snowmobilers. Should we force everyone that leaves the safety of their home to carry a locater beacon now?

If you break a leg rescuers will certainly not find you right away. The team must be assembled, and drive to the airport or to the trailhead. Assuming the beacon works. Then they must climb to your location, or if you are very very lucky, show up by helictoper. This can take hours on the easiest routes, and days on some harder routes. If the weather and snow conditions are good, which in this case they were not. If the weather is not good, the rescuers are not coming for you.

The best equipment allows a team to manage its own problems, because help is far away on a difficult route on a large mountain in winter, even if you can contact them.

 

[cdcollura]

Good afternoon,

I don't understand why the climbers didn't have location devices with them. I wouldn't go on a major boat expedition without an ePIRB.

It's an evil thing we call "COMPLACENCY" ... It is the same as not evacuating the coast before a hurricane (or quit smoking afer a heart attack).

... Nooh, It won't ACTUALLY happen to me...

 

[B Ozanne]

First off, the ground teams are mostly volunteer climbers. Secondly, those helicopters are going to fly and burn fuel anyway. If there are no real rescues, they are eventually going to simulate some. So the costs of the rescues are not nearly as much as you think. Thirdly, most rescues are for hunters, fishers, skiiers/boarders, and snowmobilers. Should we force everyone that leaves the safety of their home to carry a locater beacon now?.....

Thanks for posting this. Nobody seems to understand these facts.

I'd also argue that incremental rescue costs are very small as most of the costs are fixed. Every rescue is a form of training. Most of these people are volunteers who do it because they love to help people in need.

 

[D. Hayes]

These beacons weigh like 6 oz. Any climber say that's too much when it could save their lives and everyone else the headache is an idiot. Then the ~$300 personal cost or $5 rental fee is nothing in comparison to how much is wasted in fuel alone for search and rescue. Far as training... It's going to happen regardless of the number of rescues launched.

 

[MClarkson]

Like I allready posted, theres about 50 other items that can save your life on a steep section of glacier. You cant carry them all even if you had the money to buy them all.