Moore Debris Wall

[Jeff Duda]

Then again, who buys a house next to an interstate, then rebuilds after a tornado levels it and complains about sound?

People who don't have enough money to buy a house on land with higher property value? Don't know about the complaining part, though.

 

[Adam Lucio]

So what happens when the wall itself becomes a source of debris?

 

[Jason Foster]

And honestly....a major problem is that OK and other states, etc. just don't require block (CMU) wall construction. True, may not work 100% with a huge EF4 or 5, but they are extremely effective and not at all costly to build. I believe they are also more sustainable (less impact on trees). I never finished my LEED certification so don't quote me on that part. But I can say with certainty that tornado states should adopt more construction regs that protect not only life (like the storm closets) but also property (the entire home).

Add: There are some interesting fabrics that are being used (there is a fabric hurricane window protection that is impressive). The price is about the same as the other options but certainly something interesting if a "debris block" is desired. I could see (even if still a reach) a system that goes up during a storm. But I think that is still a major reach.

 

[Caleb Grunzke]

And honestly....a major problem is that OK and other states, etc. just don't require block (CMU) wall construction. True, may not work 100% with a huge EF4 or 5, but they are extremely effective and not at all costly to build. I believe they are also more sustainable (less impact on trees). I never finished my LEED certification so don't quote me on that part. But I can say with certainty that tornado states should adopt more construction regs that protect not only life (like the storm closets) but also property (the entire home).

CMU is not more damage resistant and actually does very poorly against strong winds. I remember listening to a presentation from Tim Marshall about the NWS storm survey after Joplin and CMU walls (particularly used at department stores) collapsed without much resistance. Tim termed these walls as "human flyswatters". Construction companies cut costs and violate building procedures by not reinforcing the hollow blocks inside with steel bars and then filling them up with concrete.

 

[Bob Hartig]

What Adam said. Will the wall be able to withstand the force of a major tornado? Seems like you'd need a mighty thick wall. Otherwise, that's a lot of surface area exposed to the wind, to say nothing of big debris slamming against it. It would be awful to have chunks of it added to the blender.

 

[Jason Foster]

CMU is not more damage resistant and actually does very poorly against strong winds. I remember listening to a presentation from Tim Marshall about the NWS storm survey after Joplin and CMU walls (particularly used at department stores) collapsed without much resistance. Tim termed these walls as "human flyswatters". Construction companies cut costs and violate building procedures by not reinforcing the hollow blocks inside with steel bars and then filling them up with concrete.

That is true for non-reinforced simple mortar only walls (not allowed anymore in many jurisdictions). I am well aware of Tim's presentation and will bat a message or two back and forth regarding various construction methods. As an architect who has studied and designed buildings (as well as being a chaser) I can assure you there are many methods of construction that are extremely resistant to high winds and debris. If you would like to learn more, I suggest starting with the Miami-Dade codes (and other hurricane codes). Additionally, you can simply look at the Hurricane Charley Documentary for various visuals of good (the Charlotte County Courthouse) and bad (the Punta Gorda Professional Center) damage from a high EF4 hurricane. Another suggested source is looking at the many newer buildings in Greensburg, KS in it's post tornado reconstruction.

What Adam said. Will the wall be able to withstand the force of a major tornado? Seems like you'd need a mighty thick wall. Otherwise, that's a lot of surface area exposed to the wind, to say nothing of big debris slamming against it. It would be awful to have chunks of it added to the blender.

A wall could resist and the methods of making in resistant to wind and debris is both in reinforcement (steel rebar and concrete filled block or cast-in-place), thickness and a strategic "folding". There also could be a means of some grading and such that would make it more practical. A berm on either side could aid in structural rigidity as well as debris trapping. Also believe that for debris trapping a solid structure would not be a good idea. Think more of a solid wall with a comb like element a few feet in front. This would both trap debris between the wall and the comb (could be angled concrete columns, somewhat like the New Orleans surge wall) as well as break into smaller, less damaging pieces.

But as mentioned and practically speaking, the scale of the wall required to make any such option viable is just impractical especially in light of so many other options.

 

[rdale]

The wall will be built for winds up to 135mph. The "tornado connection" is because they are using their disaster recovery funds from the 2013 tornado and claiming that "road noise" is a hazard similar to tornadoes, and therefore they can use yours and mine taxpayer dollars to build it. Instead of a community saferoom, or reinforcing schools, etc...

 

[Jason_Dasho]

I wonder if oig would agree with this use of mitigation funds?


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[rdale]

If FEMA approves it now, it'd be hard for them to go back to Moore later and say otherwise. It's pretty obvious (even to government employees ) that this is not a disaster mitigation project but a sound reduction project.