May I see your storm chaser license?

[Terrence Cook]

Ditto Joel's comments... Let the horse die and do not beat it. Bury it and never dig there again.

The best comparison to a storm chasing license is that of a nazi-esque gestapo that alienates the already mangled & fragile constitutional rights.

 

[Timothy Finn]

I'm a touch late to the party, but a license, per se, is definately not what you want. Perhaps you are more interested in an association, or a society. Think of like the NRA, or the AAA, or AARP. Membership is voluntary, but has some perks.

I've spent the last several hours looking up various and sundry associations and societies, ranging from the Society of Decorative Painters, all the way up to the Sports Car Club of America. There seems to be one for everything.

My point is is one could be started here, by simply taking advantage of some of the infrastructure available. MetEd is free, some courses could be required for entry, or other qualifications. Someone could see about setting up discounts at Midwest hotels for card-carrying members, and a well-written press release (nothing scrawled on a pizza box or cocktail napkin) could be circulated to the LE and EM community stating intentions, mission statements, doctrines, tenet, philosophy, whatever.

Basically, it's a thought on how to express that we're serious, we do things this way, and don't condone that, etc, etc. So, please save the flambe remarks, it's just a thought, and it is one that would probably take a decent amount of effort to first get set up, and then to maintain. But any other group that wanted credibility in the eyes of the rest of the world has done exactly this. I like using the NRA as an example. You (typically) don't need a license to own a gun, and you don't need to join the NRA, but they have credibility, without being official at anything, and they have some perks too.

Just a thought.

Tim

 

[Andy Wycislo]

We have all the laws we need already on the books to prevent the problems described here. They are called traffic laws. If cops REALLY THINK that storm chasers are a problem, they should write a few tickets for all these laws that we are supposedly breaking. Seeing as they mostly aren't, I'm guessing it's a lot of whining.

If you speed, turn without using a turn signal, or don't pull completely off the road when stopped, you deserve a ticket. I'm not saying I don't do these things sometimes (primarily the first one), but if I get caught, then yeah, I deserve a ticket.

 

[Jake Orosi]

We have all the laws we need already on the books to prevent the problems described here. They are called traffic laws. If cops REALLY THINK that storm chasers are a problem, they should write a few tickets for all these laws that we are supposedly breaking. Seeing as they mostly aren't, I'm guessing it's a lot of whining.

This is true and yet not. A cop, who is usually posted at a specific location or on his way somewhere at that moment, does not have the time to write a speeding ticket in the face of an approaching severe storm, run plates, or stop one vehicle in a fleet that's breaking a traffic rule; he can't stop directing traffic or blocking traffic or looking for victims in collapsed houses to run you down and pull you over. Chasers who would flagrantly violate traffic laws are aware of this; it's the very mechanism that allows them to get away with their mischief. So while logical, the notion that if chasers were really breaking laws they'd be getting tickets is spurious.

 

[Gordon Spencer]

I wish everyone would just use a little common sense and courtesy . Folks just do not seem to consider how their actions will effect others any more . Hardly something that can be pegged on Storm Chasers only . I hate to say it but it seems to be society as a whole

 

[Jesse Risley]

This is true and yet not. A cop, who is usually posted at a specific location or on his way somewhere at that moment, does not have the time to write a speeding ticket in the face of an approaching severe storm, run plates, or stop one vehicle in a fleet that's breaking a traffic rule; he can't stop directing traffic or blocking traffic or looking for victims in collapsed houses to run you down and pull you over. Chasers who would flagrantly violate traffic laws are aware of this; it's the very mechanism that allows them to get away with their mischief. So while logical, the notion that if chasers were really breaking laws they'd be getting tickets is spurious.

I believe that theory ignores a few variances. First, there are quite a few chasers who have been ticketed while chasing; oftentimes the citations are received while trying to catch up to a storm or while heading to the target. Granted, I don't know of any chasers who have been ticketed in the immediate vicinity of a SVR storm, or while a tornado was on the ground, but many are written at other times, and I'd be willing to bet at least a certain percentage of those citations was based on profiling. So yes, if the driving behaviors of storm chasers are perceived as being problematic, selectively targeting them for the brunt of otherwise legally permissible moving violation citations is going to make a strong statement. Though it's an entirely separate issue, I do realize there is, at the very least, an ethical issue with enforcement profiling, but it's much harder to make a case about that if the social group being profiled is stopped for bona fide legal pretexts (i.e., you were actually violating the law and the police were not just making something up and writing farcical citations).

If we're strictly talking about the need for a license, which would be rendered relevant in the immediate vicinity of something like a tornado on the ground, then yes, I agree that essentially both theories are moot. As you stated, the last thing law enforcement has time to do is enforce traffic laws or check the licensing status of some storm chaser.

 

[Chris Novy]

I say lead by example. Much of the "newbie phenomena" is simply people emulating the bad behaviors they see other chasers do --especially TV chasers. As long as we continue to suggest the single most important aspect of chasing is seeing a tornado, as long as we praise people for taking extreme risks, and as long as we suggest that the ends always justify the means we will have people doing dumb things Law enforcement needs to step up their patrols and start issuing warnings and tickets. Far too many times here in Oklahoma I've seen 5-10 newbie Oklahoma Highway Patrol guys pointlessly racing around with all their emergency lights on or parking and gawking at the storms with the rest of the chasers instead of enforcing traffic regulations. When enforcement (say speeding or improper parking) is regular and anticipated people are more likely to comply --knowing the risks of violating the law aren't worth the rewards. When enforcement is sporadic or non-existent, however, people are more likely to do whatever they want and then complain loudly about the "police state" when they are eventually targeted.

A SpotterNetwork ID number is about as close to having a "license" or being in a national database as I'd ever like to see things. When you start requiring licenses, set up road blocks, or establish curfews you impede the free travel of the 99% of the population that's not out there storm chasing. You also tie up enforcement personnel --in essence creating a problem that doesn't exist. You now, like polling place voter fraud.

..Chris..

 

[Jake Orosi]

If it is the case that chasers are indeed getting ticketed, the "if chasers were really so bad" argument can be easily dismissed.

I would be skeptical that chasers tend to be profiled by police away from storms. What does a storm chaser that's not chasing a storm look like? Just some guy in a car/truck/SUV.

 

[Jesse Risley]

If it is the case that chasers are indeed getting ticketed, the "if chasers were really so bad" argument can be easily dismissed.

I would be skeptical that chasers tend to be profiled by police away from storms. What does a storm chaser that's not chasing a storm look like? Just some guy in a car/truck/SUV.

Though not true for everyone, oftentimes out of state plates, antenna(s) on the vehicle, a camera mount and/or visible laptop are visual cues that tend to make chasers more visible than not.

 

[David Wolfson]

The times I've been pulled over I either deserved it or the officer wanted current storm information. The one ticket I got was from -- well -- speeding, not because I was recognizable as a chaser. Twice my demeanor and the fact I was from out of state got me off with a verbal warning when I could have possibly gotten a ticket.

Licensing is the granting of legal permission for someone to engage in a particular activity. Permitting is the granting of legal permission for someone to be in a particular place or area at a particular time. There is no feasible way to license stormchasing, because there is no way to distinguish a chaser from a "nature photographer", someone visiting local people, or a tourist who is simply in the "wrong place at the wrong time". It's theoretically feasible to give out stormchaser permits. Actually this is basically the equivalent of a media pass. But a permit is only violated when and if someone knows or should know they aren't supposed to be there, such as by ignoring a roadblock, posted signeage, or a lawful order to leave. All of these require considerable resources of traffic and public safety agencies to enforce, especially for transient and mobile events like severe weather. The authority already exists for these agencies to bar entry or passage on a case-by-case basis, and it's already done to the extent they're able.

 

[Jake Orosi]

Though not true for everyone, oftentimes out of state plates, antenna(s) on the vehicle, a camera mount and/or visible laptop are visual cues that tend to make chasers more visible than not.

I was under the impression that an out-of-state license plate made you less likely to be pulled over unless you are actively violating a traffic law in front of the officer. It is my understanding that local and state law enforcement usually does not have the same quick and easy access to other states' motor vehicle records databases that they have for in-state records, so patrols typically don't ask dispatch to run visiting plates on the fly unless the officer has already decided to give you a ticket.

It is true that a more conspicuous vehicle will more likely be pulled over because an officer is more likely to notice it, but that's not really "profiling".

 

[ELY M.]

no. we already have enough of govt needing licenses and stuff.
we already have driver license and vehicle registration.
I agree that some people need to have common sense.

I never got any tickets at all. police only stopped me few times as I remembered.
I went out of state for a week and police just stopped me and check on me once.

 

[kb8kmm]

I can't imagine how something like that could be enforced. "Hey you. There is serve weather in the area do you have a spotters license? You are going to jail for looking at tornado without a license." Nope I just can't image how it could ever be enforced not that it ever should be.

 

[Damon Poole]

A Storm Chaser License that will get a chaser out of trouble with the law if they have an encounter with Law Enforcement? No, I don't support it. Most LEO's have their deepest issues with chaser traffic offenses, and potential interference issues within a disaster scene. Storm photography, I don't believe, should be a valid excuse for blocking lanes of traffic, or traveling at illegal and unsafe speeds. Those should be handled on a case by case basis, and a Storm Chaser License, or Skywarn Certificate, should not be used a get out of trouble card. Professional storm researchers, news reporters, and photographers in the news media, all have rules they are required to follow, and so should spotters and chasers. There is no valid excuse for being in a disaster area unless you are there to render aid or assistance to victims. If you're spotting for research, or, in support of the warning process, it should be done safely and out of the way of emergency responders. As far as severe storm education, a valid NWS Skywarn Certificate should be more than enough to prove that a person has proper training. I strongly disagree with the notion some chasers have, that since they go mobile and spend hours and miles in the plains each year, it makes them more professional than a properly trained and equally experienced Skywarn Spotter on a local basis. The internet, with it's many online training opportunities such as UCAR- METED can help equalize the playing field between Spotters and Chasers.

 

[CZandbergen]

Guys, this is the original posters way of trolling for interest or attention. This thread is one of many. Let it go. Silly season fodder is all this is.

The plains are part of a free country and I can and will drive to where ever I chose and do whatever I want in a lawful manner. Not sure that is so hard to understand unless the person posting about it has never really done either of the above and watches too much Discovery...