• While Stormtrack has discontinued its hosting of SpotterNetwork support on the forums, keep in mind that support for SpotterNetwork issues is available by emailing [email protected].

Firing of 800 NOAA Employees

Randy Zipser said:
BTW, what is Erik Rasmussen doing these days? Is he still working?
Click to expand...
Who would be the paying "client(s)" for sustaining this 12-13 member PS Lab group that you describe above?


1. Unfortunately, I don't know.
2. An insurance industry consortium, Microsoft, Koch Industries, a government agency; there are many possibilities.
 
I debated with myself whether to post the message below due to its very partisan nature, but decided that because it relates to the NOAA firings, it is important (regardless of one's political affiliation) to be read by this forum. What it does indicate is that there is, indeed, a growing groundswell of support for the employees of the federal agencies that have been affected by the DOGE "axe." More importantly, high-ranking Congressional members are speaking out against what has been happening in Washington, so the views (like so many of those expressed here in ST) are starting to get through to people who are in a position to act on behalf of the public constituency.

Sent: Saturday, March 15, 2025 10:14 AM
Subject: The American people are not going to lie down and let Donald Trump and Elon Musk roll all over us

I awakened to the cry / that the people have the power / to redeem the work of fools. —Patti Smith

Over the past week, I joined hundreds of fired-up Democrats outside multiple federal agencies, from the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) in Silver Spring to the National Institutes of Health (NIH) in Bethesda, as we protested the mass firings of thousands of federal workers.

Since the beginning of the Trump administration’s sweeping attack on our civil service, I have received messages every day from constituents who are losing their jobs as climate scientists, food safety officials, agricultural specialists, special education experts, pediatric cancer researchers, and air traffic controllers—and their illegal firings will have devastating consequences for America.

That’s why federal workers, elected officials and citizens from all walks of life are banding together to tell Donald Trump and Elon Musk that we are NOT going to lie down and let them destroy everything that prior generations have built. As I have said now at a dozen rallies: A rally a day keeps the fascists away, and we’ll be fighting this right-wing assault on our democracy in the Congress, in the streets, in the courts, until we can declare victory over Elon Musk and his techno-state authoritarians.

Together we’re going to defend USAID and NIH, NOAA and the FDA, the Departments of Education and Labor, the J6 prosecutors and the FBI agents being targeted by Trump’s authoritarian lieutenants at DOJ, and all the federal workers, nonprofits, immigrants, refugees and members of the LGBTQ community being demonized and by this Nazi-saluting, apartheid-nostalgic Broligarch billionaire and his kleptocrat president.

I’ve been to a dozen rallies over the past month and I haven’t found paralyzing fear. What I have found is civic conviction, moral courage and unwavering determination to win. The people have the power in America, and I’ve never felt more sure that the forces of democracy and freedom will prevail in this fight.

Hang tough.

With gratitude and nothing but great high hopes for our future,

Jamie Raskin
U.S. House of Representatives (MD)
 
Last edited:
Of course, we all knew it would just be a matter of time before one of the major news networks did a story attempting to relate the recent DOGE cuts at NOAA to this past weekend's tornado outbreak. Yesterday evening (3/17/2025), MSNBC's program Inside with Jen Psaki aired such a segment. This piece had a good lead-in exclusively about the tornado outbreak and whether the NOAA layoffs may have in some way contributed to its death toll, particularly as related to warning issuance in rural areas of the states affected. I was hoping that they would post the entire video segment; however, they did post only the part (see link below) interviewing Mitch Landrieu, former Mayor of New Orleans (2010-2018), who did touch upon the necessity for NOAA's services in weather disasters. Jon Tester also spoke about broader issues that the cuts are having on agencies in rural states, like his home state of MT.

‘Nail in the coffin for rural America’: Tester breaks down the devastating impact of Trump cuts

If MSNBC does post video of this entire piece in the next day or two, I'll post it here.
 
I found part of the video segment from last night's MSNBC show that preceded the one above in Post #50! For the part about NOAA (and FEMA), go to 2:19 - 4:46 on the time counter:

www.msnbc.com

So much for loyalty: Red states ‘devastated’ by Trump cuts, tariffs

According to a New York Times analysis, red states have been disproportionately impacted by retaliatory tariffs. That, plus cuts to FEMA and NOAA, means red states will have millions less in funding for natural disasters.
www.msnbc.com www.msnbc.com
 
Another area where the NWS/NOAA can cut is modeling. They should use universities as their modeling R&D like the NFL uses college football. Please take a look at this graph.

The NWS's models have gone from #1 in the world to, at best, #4. The GFS is so bad, I rarely look at it any more (I use the ECMWF and Canadian). The HRRR, which I use, was not developed in DC or GFDL.
 

Attachments

  • Screenshot 2025-03-21 at 8.12.36 AM.png
    Screenshot 2025-03-21 at 8.12.36 AM.png
    953.7 KB · Views: 3
Mike Smith said:
Another area where the NWS/NOAA can cut is modeling. They should use universities as their modeling R&D like the NFL uses college football. Please take a look at this graph.

The NWS's models have gone from #1 in the world to, at best, #4. The GFS is so bad, I rarely look at it any more (I use the ECMWF and Canadian). The HRRR, which I use, was not developed in DC or GFDL.
Click to expand...
Very interesting, Mike. When tracking hurricanes on approach toward Florida or through the eastern Gulf of MEXICO, I've noticed during the past 4-5 years that the European Model has generally been more accurate than the GFS. In general, the intensity forecast is a bit more conservative and forward motion is a bit slower, resulting in a track either east or west (depending on the particular situation) of the GFS's (even if both models are similarly initialized). I can recall a few tropical systems recently that arrived at my latitude of Florida after dark because the slower European Model verified.

As a direct result of further cutting by the DOGE of rawinsonde launches in Alaska and the CONUS, the GFS model will hardly show improvement due to new data limitations. If the upcoming tropical season is really active for the Atlantic Basin, the NHC might have a tougher time making their ensemble forecasts as accurate as they have been, and, thus, may catch a lot of (unwarranted) negative criticism. But...who's going to blame Trump/DOGE? Sadly, the answer is "Nobody!"
 
Randy Zipser said:
As a direct result of further cutting by the DOGE of rawinsonde launches in Alaska and the CONUS,
Click to expand...
Can you show me where DOGE has cut these launches? I have been sifting through the doge.gov website but don't see it. If the inference is that X$ has been cut and the agency has used its discretion in that way, that's fine. I get it.

There can be discretion in how to meet mandated cuts. In NJ our school district budget failed at the polls and by state law the budget went to the Township government for review. As Board President, I flatly told the Mayor in a public meeting that he could tell us how much to cut but he could not tell us where to cut. (Boy was he mad.)

If NOAA/NWS decides to cut launches in response to budget cuts that is their business but the agency answers to its stakeholders for that discretion.
 
Mike Smith said:
This is pure malicious compliance. They are playing politics with the lives of the American people:
Breaking News: National Weather Service to Further Cut Weather Balloon Network
Click to expand...
That is one way to look at it, but as I pointed out to someone on social media last night, my understanding is that it takes about 15 minutes to prep and do a balloon launch (based on what I have read on NWS websites - I have done high altitude balloon launches before and it typically takes that long just to do the fill). If an office is short staffed (for any reason - could be DOGE cuts or the long standing staffing issues at NWS), they may honestly feel that the risk of going a person at the desk down for 15 minutes is bigger than the benefit of the launches. I know in the Delta 191 NTSB investigation many years ago it came up that a radar operator had left the desk for dinner when the accident happened (although the final report did say he could still monitor the radar from a TV in the break room). A lot has changed since then (heck I don't think him being at the desk would have helped anyway), but I know that after that there was concern about folks leaving the desk for even short periods of time.
 
STAFF NOTE:

We do understand that the cuts to federal agencies such as NOAA and specifically the NWS as an agency are highly relevant to the nature of what concerns Stormtrack members the most. We also realize that it is nearly impossible to separate public policy discussions from those which are "political" when discussing circumstances like this and there has been much good discussion thus far. While we normally reserve "political" discussions for the Bear's Cage this one falls under the narrow exception of being both immediately weather related and relevant to weather in the news as a sub-forum. Everyone is encouraged to a) stay on topic insofar as the discussion is centered around the termination of NOAA (or specifically the NWS as an agency) employees and/or the impact of budgetary cuts therein, b) avoid steering into overtly partisan political discussions that are not germane specifically to NOAA or the NWS as an agency, and c) remain civil and avoid ad hominem snipes against those who may be on another end of the so-called Overton Window than you are. All of that helps to lower the signal-to-noise ration and promote civil discourse on a very timely and important public policy issue for this community.
 
Randy Jennings said:
That is one way to look at it, but as I pointed out to someone on social media last night, my understanding is that it takes about 15 minutes to prep and do a balloon launch (based on what I have read on NWS websites - I have done high altitude balloon launches before and it typically takes that long just to do the fill). If an office is short staffed (for any reason - could be DOGE cuts or the long standing staffing issues at NWS), they may honestly feel that the risk of going a person at the desk down for 15 minutes is bigger than the benefit of the launches. I know in the Delta 191 NTSB investigation many years ago it came up that a radar operator had left the desk for dinner when the accident happened (although the final report did say he could still monitor the radar from a TV in the break room). A lot has changed since then (heck I don't think him being at the desk would have helped anyway), but I know that after that there was concern about folks leaving the desk for even short periods of time.
Click to expand...

Absolutely: If severe weather is in progress, they should stay with the severe weather.*

But, there is absolutely no reason that on "fair" weather days they cannot do two launches a day. It just doesn't take that long. And, if it does, why hasn't that labor (DEN, CHH, TLH, etc.)from those offices been transferred to launching offices since they no longer launch at all. [Of course, it doesn't take that long.]

*With regard to DL 191, I cover it in my book as I was an expert witness in the litigation. As it turns out, both the radar operator (in Stephenville, TX, NWS thought it was a good idea to locate radars outside of cities in that era) and the storm warning meteorologist at FTW NWS were at dinner at the same time -- which is when the crash occurred.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top