Dan Cook
EF5
Now that I finally bought an HDTV I'm looking for a good HD video camera. What are some good low light ones? I know Mike H didn't like his.
-
After witnessing the continued decrease of involvement in the SpotterNetwork staff in serving SN members with troubleshooting issues recently, I have unilaterally decided to terminate the relationship between SpotterNetwork's support and Stormtrack. I have witnessed multiple users unable to receive support weeks after initiating help threads on the forum. I find this lack of response from SpotterNetwork officials disappointing and a failure to hold up their end of the agreement that was made years ago, before I took over management of this site. In my opinion, having Stormtrack users sit and wait for so long to receive help on SpotterNetwork issues on the Stormtrack forums reflects poorly not only on SpotterNetwork, but on Stormtrack and (by association) me as well. Since the issue has not been satisfactorily addressed, I no longer wish for the Stormtrack forum to be associated with SpotterNetwork.
I apologize to those who continue to have issues with the service and continue to see their issues left unaddressed. Please understand that the connection between ST and SN was put in place long before I had any say over it. But now that I am the "captain of this ship," it is within my right (nay, duty) to make adjustments as I see necessary. Ending this relationship is such an adjustment.
For those who continue to need help, I recommend navigating a web browswer to SpotterNetwork's About page, and seeking the individuals listed on that page for all further inquiries about SpotterNetwork.
From this moment forward, the SpotterNetwork sub-forum has been hidden/deleted and there will be no assurance that any SpotterNetwork issues brought up in any of Stormtrack's other sub-forums will be addressed. Do not rely on Stormtrack for help with SpotterNetwork issues.
Sincerely, Jeff D.
HD Video Cameras
- Thread starter Dan Cook
- Start date
Matt Hughes
I own a Canon XH-A1 and I love it. The one thing I have noticed is that if you're a perfectionist like me then infinity focus doesn't give you the best detail. A mixture of auto and manual focus seems to work best. You just have to work with the camera a while to get the hang of it. But of course the low light could be better. Mostly if you're shooting at night. I don't think you can find a good low light HD camera for less than 5k. I think in the next year or two good low light HD will be a lot more affordable.
Billy Griffin
+1 on the Canon XH-A1 or the XL-H1. Had mine over a year now, and absolutely LOVE the video quality.
Justin Teague
EF3
I have been a preacher of the VX2100 gospel since 2004, but on May 24th, Greg McLauglin and I filmed several tornadoes in HD. The HD cam is a modest JVC Everio, but it absolutely destroys the VX2100 for daytime shots. Having said this, the low-light sucks compared to the VX2100, but if I was in the market for a new camera, I wouldn't think twice about going HD, even though the low-light capabilites aren't all that great. Go to www.camcorderinfo.com and read their reviews, I have found them to be most helpful. I have only had 1 situation where I truly appreciated the VX2100's low-light capability, and that was on May 11th, 2005. I have found that in most cases, if it's dark enough to need a camera that is rated at less than 3 lux, you aren't going to have good video anyways. Get an HD with a decent low-light rating and you won't be disappointed in the least.
So, in a nutshell, I can't tell you what HD camcorder to buy, but I can tell you that my first experience with one was GREAT, and that www.camcorderinfo.com has all of the information for you to make an informed decision before you buy. Good luck!
So, in a nutshell, I can't tell you what HD camcorder to buy, but I can tell you that my first experience with one was GREAT, and that www.camcorderinfo.com has all of the information for you to make an informed decision before you buy. Good luck!
Verne Carlson
EF5
I think you'll get the best performance and low light quality with a number of brands as long as you go with 3 CCD technology. Don't bother with CMOS, 3 CCD will do much better. I've had the Sony HDR-FX1 for years and love it. I just picked up a Panasonic HDC-SD9 and it's amazing what you can get in a palm sized 0.9 oz camera. This is what I'll be flying on our Helicopter:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/536077-REG/Panasonic_HDC_SD9_HDC_SD9_SDHC_Flash_Memory.html
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/536077-REG/Panasonic_HDC_SD9_HDC_SD9_SDHC_Flash_Memory.html
Dan Cook
EF5
Dan Robinson
Just remember that CMOS chip-based HD cameras will have problems with lightning. If you don't shoot much lightning footage, it's not an issue.
Brandon Ivey
EF2
I have been in the market for a HD camcorder for a while, just haven't purchased one yet. I jumped into the digital camera market way too early and feel my Nikon D70 was a waste of money. Sure it is a good camera, but I could buy the D200 right now for what I paid for the D70 three years ago. Other than the price tags on the HD camcorders, this is the main reason I have not purchased one yet.
This is what I am looking at though. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/357486-REG/Sony_HVRZ1U_HVR_Z1U_1_3_Inch_3_CCD_HDV.html
Does anyone have this camcorder that can post a review using it from a chasing standpoint? I hate that the LCD screen is located so high up. The porta brace would be a pain to put on this thing.
This is what I am looking at though. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/357486-REG/Sony_HVRZ1U_HVR_Z1U_1_3_Inch_3_CCD_HDV.html
Does anyone have this camcorder that can post a review using it from a chasing standpoint? I hate that the LCD screen is located so high up. The porta brace would be a pain to put on this thing.
Bill Hark
EF5
I bought the Z1 early this Spring and learned how to use it just in time for chase season. It is a very nice camera. 3CCD with decent low light level. Not as great as my VX2100 but good. Very flexible as one can output in widescreen or cropped SD. It is a bit heavy. I haven't found the LCD screen placement to be annoying. You may be able to get away with the FX1 if you don't need in-camera cropping to 4:3.
Both the FX1 and Z1 do not have HDMI output. I bought a smaller cannon HV20 to use as a deck and to copy tapes in HDV format without loss. I also use the HV20 to output HDV to a friend's HDV TV. Other minor annnoyance: it is easy to bump the manual focus ring and take the camcorder off of infinity lock.
I really like the Z1. I couldn't afford a new one but I took a chance on Ebay and did well. There are a lot of Z1's on the market.
Bill Hark
Dan Robinson
(This is a re-post from an old thread, but probably more relevant for this one)
Currently there is no consumer HD video camera (under $3,000) that can perform well for all-purpose chasing use. All of the consumer models use CMOS chips, which cannot capture lightning video without rolling shutter split-screen artifacting. Unfortunately many prosumer lines are switching to all-CMOS now in their newer models. If you are not concerned with lightning footage, then just about any of the current camera offerings will suffice for daytime tornado video.
The least expensive camera suitable for all-purpose chase use is the 3CCD Sony HDR-FX1. That's the bare minimum you need for at least good lightning footage. However, even the FX1 lacks in low light performance compared to a standard-definition VX2100.
The cheapest HD camera that both uses CCDs and has good low light performance is the Sony XDCAM F350, a full-size shoulder-mount professional camera which will run you about $35,000 (body plus a cheap lens). That is the cheapest single HD camera model that can obtain a good image in nearly all chasing circumstances. If you've got more than $40,000 to spend, your options increase in number.
You could get away with spending $16,000 on two cameras (less than half the price of the F350) to get the job done. You could buy a Panasonic HVX-200 and a Sony XDCAM EX-1 for about $8,000 apeice. With its CCD chips and fast 100Mbps DVCPRO-HD codec, the Panasonic will get great lightning video - but it has small CCDs and is terrible in low light. The Sony EX-1 is much better in low light (for storm structure and tornadoes), but it is useless for lightning with its CMOS chips.
Unfortunately, CMOS is taking over due to its low cost and good performance. Lightning is too specialized of a subject for camera manufacturers to design for or care about. Even the $17,000 4K RED camera uses CMOS and therefore can't handle lightning (or anything with rapid flashes, like scenes with camera flashes or strobe lights).
FYI, here is a write-up I posted about lightning problems with HD cameras:
http://stormhighway.com/blog/may208a.shtml
Currently there is no consumer HD video camera (under $3,000) that can perform well for all-purpose chasing use. All of the consumer models use CMOS chips, which cannot capture lightning video without rolling shutter split-screen artifacting. Unfortunately many prosumer lines are switching to all-CMOS now in their newer models. If you are not concerned with lightning footage, then just about any of the current camera offerings will suffice for daytime tornado video.
The least expensive camera suitable for all-purpose chase use is the 3CCD Sony HDR-FX1. That's the bare minimum you need for at least good lightning footage. However, even the FX1 lacks in low light performance compared to a standard-definition VX2100.
The cheapest HD camera that both uses CCDs and has good low light performance is the Sony XDCAM F350, a full-size shoulder-mount professional camera which will run you about $35,000 (body plus a cheap lens). That is the cheapest single HD camera model that can obtain a good image in nearly all chasing circumstances. If you've got more than $40,000 to spend, your options increase in number.
You could get away with spending $16,000 on two cameras (less than half the price of the F350) to get the job done. You could buy a Panasonic HVX-200 and a Sony XDCAM EX-1 for about $8,000 apeice. With its CCD chips and fast 100Mbps DVCPRO-HD codec, the Panasonic will get great lightning video - but it has small CCDs and is terrible in low light. The Sony EX-1 is much better in low light (for storm structure and tornadoes), but it is useless for lightning with its CMOS chips.
Unfortunately, CMOS is taking over due to its low cost and good performance. Lightning is too specialized of a subject for camera manufacturers to design for or care about. Even the $17,000 4K RED camera uses CMOS and therefore can't handle lightning (or anything with rapid flashes, like scenes with camera flashes or strobe lights).
FYI, here is a write-up I posted about lightning problems with HD cameras:
http://stormhighway.com/blog/may208a.shtml
I have to disagree with this comment. A D70 is still a very strong camera. The D70 and the D200 were never meant to compete with each other as they are completely different markets they're aimed at. It's like trying to compare a current D40 with a D300 or D3. They're three completely different lines of cameras. Besides, you've gotten 3 years out of it now that you otherwise wouldn't have had. What is it that you miss? Remember that cameras being solely measured and compared just by their megapixels is just BS. The only compelling thing I could see with moving from a D70, D70s, or even anything newer would be if you're going to the full size sensor of the D3. Everything else is just marketing.
As far as HD cams go, I'd agree with most that if you're looking at going HD, you really need to spend the money at this point. Of course, having such a workhorse in the VX2100 for comparison, I think it may be a while before we see a bang-for-the-buck camera like that. Sony knows it too, that's why the price on the 2100 hasn't moved in three years...
-John
Brandon Ivey
EF2
Thanks for the feedback! I am still on the fence about switching to HD at the moment as I want to make sure it will be worth the big expense. I don't want to give up what I get with the VX2100. Thanks for the comment on the D70 John. I was not complaining about the camera. I agree that it is a good camera. It is just amazing how fast the models dissapear from the market and loose value. The same thing happened when I purchased the Nikon N90s around 2001.
John Erwin
EF5
Unfortunately that's the way technology works. The cash value will normally always decline over time; your "investment" is reaped via what you use the device for.
William Reid
EF2
Sony HVR-Z1U
Brandon Ivey asked for some feedback on the Sony HVR-Z1U. I purchased my Z1U just prior to the 2006 chase season. This camcorder is Sony's prosumer 3-CCD HD camcorder, and still retails for close to $5000.
My Sony PD100A was starting to fall apart after six good chase years, so in 2006 I decided to jump to HD. I have been/had been fairly satisfied with Sony (beginning with my V701 Hi-8 in 1991 and then the PD100A DVCAM in 2000), so I wanted another Sony camcorder. The price tag on the Z1U was (and is) really steep, but I figured that I chase a lot and eventually I will get some video that will pay for the machine. I also wanted a camcorder which is VERY sturdy and well constructed, as I do not tend to treat my equipment with the greatest of care. The Z1U has proven to be a rugged workhorse thus far for me. If you are like me and tend to leave your camcorder out in the rain too long, smack it around in the vehicle, and treat it like it cost only 150 bucks, the Z1U can handle the abuse.
Back in 2006 I wanted the 3 CCDs, I wanted the manual focus/infinity lock, wanted the full manual-override capability of white balance, aperture and shutter speed; and I wanted a decent lux rating. The only Sony HD camcorder which came close was the Z1U, and it appeared to be virtually the perfect storm chaser camcorder available ---- just awfully pricey! I bit the bullet and bought one, and I have no regrets thus far.
Concerning reliability ---- My unit has performed almost flawlessly through three chase seasons. It has failed me three times, I think. Twice it asked for the cleaning cassette to be run through it when it was dusty (ALWAYS have the cleaning cassette handy!!). The cleaning cassette solved the problem quickly both times. The other time it balked because I had the a/c blowing on it. I got it outside, and it fogged up badly (as the wall cloud was tightening up, naturally). After about 15 minutes and changing batteries, it decided to work again. I haven't used it yet in a hurricane. My Z1U has been used for perhaps 50-60 hours of storm video, plus tape-logging and chase-video work. I do not mount it in the vehicle as a dash-mount camcorder, as it is indeed rather large and unwieldy. It is used primarily outside on a tripod, so it is definitely exposed to the elements while being used. Of the moving parts, the only thing that is not operating properly now is the front plastic shutter/lens cover. It does not open and close as it should, but this is not a big issue.
Concerning picture quality ----- I really can not say much because I have yet to view my HD footage on an HD television! My 2006 chase video ("It Should Have Happened Yesterday"---blatant plug) was down-converted from HD to SD, and it looked great on my SD TV. I always have the thing on infinity lock when shooting storms, so I sure hope that the images look sharp when I finally look at them on an HD set!
Concerning low light --- the Z1U is good-to-adequate. The Sony 2100 DV camcorder is much better in low light than the Z1U....but the 2100 is better than almost everything in low light anyway! With the Z1U, I can slow the shutter speed down to 1/30, 1/15, 1/8, or 1/4 sec to increase light levels if necessary.
Concerning manual overrides and buttons and bells and whistles ---- the learning curve for the WB, SS, and aperture overrides is fairly easy, and the wheels and buttons are easy to locate and adjust. I like to play around some with aperture in stormy/sunset conditions, and usually have the shutter speed at 1/30 sec when tripodded and shooting lightning. The ND density filter message tends to appear more than necessary, but it is an easy adjustment to make it happy. I used the Z1U at an outdoor concert, and stood front-and-center. I had the audio on auto, and the bass drum was too loud and distorted the audio track badly. So, close thunder will likely be distorted, too, if the audio levels are not set accordingly (I believe they can be---in cases where extremely loud sounds are possible). Otherwise, the unit's built-in microphone performs fine.
The Z1U has done everything that I wanted it to do so far with only the three brief interruptions. I have no complaints after three full chase seasons (and I chase for most of May and June every year!). I would definitely recommend it to chasers who want a rugged, reliable, 3-chip CCD HD camcorder. Please feel free to throw any other questions regarding it towards me if you'd like.
I am now in the market for another Sony HD camcorder, primarily so I can make direct HD dubs (tape-to-tape) from my Z1U. I will likely get the Sony HDR-HC9. It will be used as a dashcam camcorder, and as my "HD deck". If anyone knows of any issues regarding dubbing HD (via firewire) to and from the Sony HDR-HC9, please let me know!
William Reid
[email protected]
Brandon Ivey asked for some feedback on the Sony HVR-Z1U. I purchased my Z1U just prior to the 2006 chase season. This camcorder is Sony's prosumer 3-CCD HD camcorder, and still retails for close to $5000.
My Sony PD100A was starting to fall apart after six good chase years, so in 2006 I decided to jump to HD. I have been/had been fairly satisfied with Sony (beginning with my V701 Hi-8 in 1991 and then the PD100A DVCAM in 2000), so I wanted another Sony camcorder. The price tag on the Z1U was (and is) really steep, but I figured that I chase a lot and eventually I will get some video that will pay for the machine. I also wanted a camcorder which is VERY sturdy and well constructed, as I do not tend to treat my equipment with the greatest of care. The Z1U has proven to be a rugged workhorse thus far for me. If you are like me and tend to leave your camcorder out in the rain too long, smack it around in the vehicle, and treat it like it cost only 150 bucks, the Z1U can handle the abuse.
Back in 2006 I wanted the 3 CCDs, I wanted the manual focus/infinity lock, wanted the full manual-override capability of white balance, aperture and shutter speed; and I wanted a decent lux rating. The only Sony HD camcorder which came close was the Z1U, and it appeared to be virtually the perfect storm chaser camcorder available ---- just awfully pricey! I bit the bullet and bought one, and I have no regrets thus far.
Concerning reliability ---- My unit has performed almost flawlessly through three chase seasons. It has failed me three times, I think. Twice it asked for the cleaning cassette to be run through it when it was dusty (ALWAYS have the cleaning cassette handy!!). The cleaning cassette solved the problem quickly both times. The other time it balked because I had the a/c blowing on it. I got it outside, and it fogged up badly (as the wall cloud was tightening up, naturally). After about 15 minutes and changing batteries, it decided to work again. I haven't used it yet in a hurricane. My Z1U has been used for perhaps 50-60 hours of storm video, plus tape-logging and chase-video work. I do not mount it in the vehicle as a dash-mount camcorder, as it is indeed rather large and unwieldy. It is used primarily outside on a tripod, so it is definitely exposed to the elements while being used. Of the moving parts, the only thing that is not operating properly now is the front plastic shutter/lens cover. It does not open and close as it should, but this is not a big issue.
Concerning picture quality ----- I really can not say much because I have yet to view my HD footage on an HD television! My 2006 chase video ("It Should Have Happened Yesterday"---blatant plug) was down-converted from HD to SD, and it looked great on my SD TV. I always have the thing on infinity lock when shooting storms, so I sure hope that the images look sharp when I finally look at them on an HD set!
Concerning low light --- the Z1U is good-to-adequate. The Sony 2100 DV camcorder is much better in low light than the Z1U....but the 2100 is better than almost everything in low light anyway! With the Z1U, I can slow the shutter speed down to 1/30, 1/15, 1/8, or 1/4 sec to increase light levels if necessary.
Concerning manual overrides and buttons and bells and whistles ---- the learning curve for the WB, SS, and aperture overrides is fairly easy, and the wheels and buttons are easy to locate and adjust. I like to play around some with aperture in stormy/sunset conditions, and usually have the shutter speed at 1/30 sec when tripodded and shooting lightning. The ND density filter message tends to appear more than necessary, but it is an easy adjustment to make it happy. I used the Z1U at an outdoor concert, and stood front-and-center. I had the audio on auto, and the bass drum was too loud and distorted the audio track badly. So, close thunder will likely be distorted, too, if the audio levels are not set accordingly (I believe they can be---in cases where extremely loud sounds are possible). Otherwise, the unit's built-in microphone performs fine.
The Z1U has done everything that I wanted it to do so far with only the three brief interruptions. I have no complaints after three full chase seasons (and I chase for most of May and June every year!). I would definitely recommend it to chasers who want a rugged, reliable, 3-chip CCD HD camcorder. Please feel free to throw any other questions regarding it towards me if you'd like.
I am now in the market for another Sony HD camcorder, primarily so I can make direct HD dubs (tape-to-tape) from my Z1U. I will likely get the Sony HDR-HC9. It will be used as a dashcam camcorder, and as my "HD deck". If anyone knows of any issues regarding dubbing HD (via firewire) to and from the Sony HDR-HC9, please let me know!
William Reid
[email protected]
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