Oklahoma Fire Chief Incident from May 16

Discussion in 'Weather In The News' started by Tony Laubach, May 16, 2017.

  1. rdale

    rdale Member

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    I'm not sure I follow your reasoning... What "amends" does Tony need to make with the fire chief? How is the chasing community as a whole impacted by this event?
     
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  2. Joey Ketcham

    Joey Ketcham Member

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    Agreed. The only thing that needs to happen is that the fire chief resigns from his position due to his inability to control his temper. Tony did nothing wrong, so the fire chief's action has absolutely no impact on the chasing community. So not sure what amends needs to be made that Greg Flint speaks of or this impact he speaks of.
     
  3. Dan Robinson

    Dan Robinson WxLibrary Editor
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    My first snap reaction was that we'd have more trouble from the small town fire/EMS element as they "dig in" in defiance. But now, I have to wonder, if word of this makes the rounds in the fire/EMS community that the awareness of chasers running video cameras might make a similarly-tempered individual think twice before acting out like this.
     
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  4. Warren Faidley

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    Events involving chasers are lost in the news cycle now days. What became of the tragic deaths this year? Nothing. No new laws were passed and I have not heard of anyone being harassed by LEO in the area. People continued to run stop signs and crash.

    We have reached the point where human realities of death, injury, stupidity, fakery, hostility, etc., are now an accepted part of chasing. The public rarely takes notices. We discuss events here, but they are otherwise lost in space. I would assume all pursuits have gone through this type of evolution, from mountain climbing to base jumping. Six people have died so far this year trying to climb Everest. A number like that used to be news worthy -- but not anymore.
     
  5. S Kalka

    S Kalka Member

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    I doubt that it will make any difference at all. In their opinion they are not doing anything wrong. First, I have been a member of a volunteer department for over 27 years, so I can take an educated guess about their intentions. In my dept. it's usually the newer guys that do the weather spotting, and all they know is what they could pick up at a NWS class, so they probably were a little excited. I don't know about OK, but in IL we can only block traffic for fire operations or to protect firefighter/victim at an accident scene. But since emergency vehicle operation is not a "bread and butter" topic for their limited training time (I can only remember about 2 hours in 27 years), they probably didn't know any better. Bottom line is that I would have done what Tony did, but I also would have expected the kid in the brush truck to do what he did. Also, much has been made of the fire chief using his personal vehicle. This is very common. It makes no sense for a 'command officer' to drive to the firehouse to get a marked vehicle and return to the scene if the scene is closer to whatever location he is responding from. As far as the actions of the chief, I'm sure he heard on his radio that "some crazy chaser almost hit my truck." I can understand him being pissed off, but that doesn't excuse him acting like an asshat and beating on Tonys car hood. The chief, in my opinion, was the only one that was out of line, but no video will convince any of the locals of that. Video is only going to make a difference if there is an accident, and only to the insurance company lawyers. Remember, these are the guys that get out of bed at 3 AM to put out the neighbors house fire, or helped grandma when she had a heart attack, and for no pay. If you think an out of state chasers words or even video will change their minds, you're wrong.
     
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  6. Greg Flint

    Greg Flint Member

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    I thought I was clear Rdale/Joey, but something must have been lost in translation. In my originsl post, If I substituted "other chasers need to make amends" instead of "chasers need to make amends" would that help you understand what I'm talking about?

    I never said Tony needs to make amends. Read my post again, I never said that because that's not how I feel.

    I thought My post was pretty clear, but if you single out one sentence, you will surely lose context likely based on your own biases, but because I aim to please I'll attempt to clarify For anyone who may have misinterpreted what I wrote:

    I'm not singling out Tony, infact I was attempting to do just the opposite, and state countless other idiot chasers/stories caused the OKC fire chief's anger and frustration (along with personal issues he obviously has). Yes that's wrong. If you or anyone want him to resign, HA!! Guess what!?? There are half a dozen more with his same views/actions ready to take his place and you know it. Maybe this aggression is caused for lots of reasons, but maybe one or two of those reasons Is because there are a coupe of people out there who have soured the taste towards this community as a whole. Doesn't make his aggression any more or less fucked up or misguided, but That's everyone who chases problem now whether u want to admit it or not.

    Tony did the right thing (and unfairly got a lot of flack for it). Problem is the OK chief (and prob many other EM personel) don't see it that way. Tony backed up his actions with proof via video/image, but cats already out of the bag from Too many fucking idiots, driving around like maniacs chasing that are the bad apples spoiling it for the whole bunch. I never said Tony was a bad apple or needs to make amends for anything and I hope that's clear to you now
     
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  7. Lou Ruh

    Lou Ruh Noob

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    [QUOTE="Also, much has been made of the fire chief using his personal vehicle. This is very common. It makes no sense for a 'command officer' to drive to the firehouse to get a marked vehicle and return to the scene if the scene is closer to whatever location he is responding from. [/QUOTE]
    Well ... I can only reply based on my training in my state, but, in PA, they can indeed use their POV, but, without the proper lights (and audible signals to be used while responding if outfitted with flashing red lights), they are not emergency vehicles and are not to be used to block traffic, break traffic laws, etc. Responders can also equip vehicles with flashing blue lights but no siren (with authorization and blue is the only color to be used in that case), but, those are only "courtesy" lights, so, they are also not supposed to be used to block traffic, break traffic laws, etc.

    If this incident happened in PA (and states with similar laws), I think much would be made about it (if the word got out), it is unlikely that it would be swept under the rug. In PA, the chief would have been dead wrong for 1) Blocking the road with an non-emergency vehicle 2) Committing assault ... and could be prosecuted . And, nowadays, the chances of something like this going public are pretty high. I would guess there are some different laws in OK, but, assuming they are similar, the guy was dead wrong.
     
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  8. rdale

    rdale Member

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    No :) You said chasers need to "continue the much needed dialogue to address this very incident" which seems to refer to Tony's incident. Chasers and non-chasers outside of this thread probably have zero clue this happened. Suggesting that we sit down with our local fire chief to "make amends" still doesn't translate for me.
     
  9. Chris Sokol

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    Having been a firefighter for 25 years both in Oklahoma and in other states, I can say this with zero doubt...if I had been operating the fire vehicle in question and swerved like that, and struck another vehicle in the process, I would have been found to be 100% responsible for causing the accident and held both liable and accountable. No excuse for behavior like that...zero. And as for the "professionalism" of the fire chief.....
     
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  10. Greg Flint

    Greg Flint Member

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    I disagree. While its not front page news in the Wall Street Journal or NY Times, the encounter happened in a small town of 256 people (county 22k). I'm sure EM & families/friends at the very least are aware of the situation in a town that small. Word spreads, especially negative words towards a group of people to be criticized in media as of late (traffic problems, accidents resulting in death to name a few). The encounter and subsequent defense by Tony (and rightfully so) caused the chief's wife to ring up Tony's employer, so the story has reached a far wider audience than zero.
     
  11. rdale

    rdale Member

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    Of course people in that town know - what I'm arguing against is the claim that chasers as a whole need to sit down with EMs as a whole and discuss the problem. There is no widespread problem, there are pockets. There is no widespread chaser-running-stopsigns issue, but there are pockets.
     
  12. justinmacauley

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